Discussion:
The Night Of "The Call of the Wild" (spoilers)
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Adam H. Kerman
2016-08-29 05:36:17 UTC
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Very well done and I was mostly satisfied with the resolution.

The murderer turns out to be Rina E. Ynjfba, someone we never suspected
who wasn't even on Stone's radar. It goes back to the argument that
we knew Andrea had with someone unknown that night, although we didn't
know that Andrea was being followed when she hailed Naz's cab.

Stone really wanted it to be the evil stepfather. There's a nice scene
in which Stone riles him up when he serves the supeona, and then
deliberately enters the courthouse ahead of him, flipping him the bird
as he's getting patted down. He wants this guy to come off as a possibly
dangerous asshole in testimony.

There's a nice resolution to Stone's eczema/allergies, and it all comes
back to haunt him. We learn that his worst symptoms are stress induced,
if not psychosomatic. In a nice sequence, Chandra refuses to take his
advice and puts Naz on the stand. Naz is not compelling enough in his
defense, and Helen Weiss is able to get a rise out of him on cross.
Stone tells her that she just got Naz convicted, so an infuriated Stone
takes it out on the cat, which he takes back to the animal shelter.

Naz told Chandra he wouldn't be cool enough to take the stand and
demands that she buy him drugs. Well, she doesn't just bring him
a sedative, but a pussy-full of sedatives. The two of them think they're
being careful but the evidence of the exchange is caught on tape.

Stone receives the tape and convinces Naz to use it as grounds for a
mistrial. Now, Stone believes that now-retired Det. Box leaked him the
information, but it's actually Omar. Naz agrees. Stone turns Chandra
in to the judge; her life as an attorney is over. It backfires on Stone,
as the judge orders him to sit first chair and deliver the closing argument.

Stone puts himself under so much stress that his eczema flares up bad,
and he takes every single treatment he'd been given at the same time,
including soaking his feet in bleach. This sends him to the E.R. where
he's given a massive dose of steroids. He's able to wear shoes but has
to wear gloves in court and his face looks horrible.

See, I think that, despite being allergic to the cat, the cat kept him
relatively calm which is what eased his symptoms quite a bit.

Det. Box brought his suspicions to Helen Weiss. Learning that she'll
continue to prosecute Naz, he walks out of her closing arugment. Helen
is actually thrown and may not have completed it. Helen has committed a
major ethical breach herself: She failed to disclose to the defense.

The jury is hung. The foreman reports that the vote is 6 to 6 with no
hope of breaking the deadlock. The judge is stunned and dismisses the jury.
Knowing about her failure to disclose and how strong Box feels about another
prime suspect, Helen has second thoughts about Naz's guilt and declines
to prosecute.

On his way out of Rikers, Omar leaves Naz the novel in the title.

Naz tries to reconcile with his family. He can't. His mother tries to
convince him that she never lost faith in him but Naz knows it's a lie.

Helen tells Box to get the evidence against the other suspect. We do have
a brief scene of Box attempting to play golf.

Naz thanks Stone for saving his neck. Stone tells him that we all have our
crosses to bear and not to worry that people he knows think he's guilty.
In an interesting moment, Naz's so-called friend who was supposed to have
driven him on The Night Of comes into the restaurant where they're sitting.
Naz gives him a look of contempt but doesn't rise from the table to
confront him. Stone points out that he did learn something after all.

It ends with Naz on the riverbank where Andrea had him drive her, thinking
of her and his own innocence lost.

I'd like to commend various outstanding performances, although everyone
was good. Riz Ahmed's compelling innocence carried the early episodes.
Without his natural performance, it could have been unwatchable. I really
liked Jeannie Berlin as Helen. Looking her up, she was born in Los
Angeles; you'd think she would have come from Queens. She's Elaine May's
daughter! That explains the voice. Bill Camp and Amara Karan were both
good. Having seen Turturro as Stone, I just can't imagine Gandolfini.
Omar is excellent as always.

Since HBO series tend to get Emmy nominations, let's hope that some
of the supporting cast are recognized and that Ahmed is NOT nominated
for supporting but for lead.
Robin Miller
2016-08-29 06:11:53 UTC
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Post by Adam H. Kerman
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Very well done and I was mostly satisfied with the resolution.
Very nice summary of a series I found quite compelling, and unlike any
TV I have really watched before. I was terrified for Naz the whole long
walk out of Rikers and was fearful there would be an attempt on his
life. I even felt sorry for Freddie, punching that bag so hard because
he had lost his "unicorn," and he even had the kindness to give Naz the
book. Every performance was good; John Turturro's was exceptional, and,
yes, it's hard to imagine anyone else in that role. My favorite "small"
role was Fisher Stevens as the pharmacist. And for a British
rapper/actor to convincingly play a Pakistani-American college student
from New York was quite an achievement.

Bravo.

--Robin
Barry Margolin
2016-08-29 15:21:29 UTC
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Post by Robin Miller
Post by Adam H. Kerman
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Very well done and I was mostly satisfied with the resolution.
Very nice summary of a series I found quite compelling, and unlike any
TV I have really watched before. I was terrified for Naz the whole long
walk out of Rikers and was fearful there would be an attempt on his
life. I even felt sorry for Freddie, punching that bag so hard because
he had lost his "unicorn," and he even had the kindness to give Naz the
book. Every performance was good; John Turturro's was exceptional, and,
yes, it's hard to imagine anyone else in that role. My favorite "small"
role was Fisher Stevens as the pharmacist. And for a British
rapper/actor to convincingly play a Pakistani-American college student
from New York was quite an achievement.
Agreed. It seems like an early favorite for many Emmy nods next year.
--
Barry Margolin
Arlington, MA
Nil
2016-08-30 22:16:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Robin Miller
I even felt sorry for Freddie, punching that bag so hard because
he had lost his "unicorn," and he even had the kindness to give
Naz the book.
I still have some trouble buying Freddy's character and motivation.
He was kind to Naz, but he was obviously king dog of that prison,
and you don't get to that position by being nice and kind. I kept
expecting him to betray Naz, like Naz's first "friend" in jail did,
but it didn't happen. Freddy's attitude toward Naz just seemed more
poetic than believable.
Micky DuPree
2016-09-06 10:10:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by Nil
Post by Robin Miller
I even felt sorry for Freddie, punching that bag so hard because
he had lost his "unicorn," and he even had the kindness to give
Naz the book.
I still have some trouble buying Freddy's character and motivation.
He was kind to Naz, but he was obviously king dog of that prison,
and you don't get to that position by being nice and kind. I kept
expecting him to betray Naz, like Naz's first "friend" in jail did,
but it didn't happen. Freddy's attitude toward Naz just seemed more
poetic than believable.
Freddie wasn't just an altruistic friend, though. He got Naz to commit
felonies for him and got Naz hooked on heroin.

-Micky
moviePig
2016-09-06 12:51:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by Micky DuPree
Post by Nil
Post by Robin Miller
I even felt sorry for Freddie, punching that bag so hard because
he had lost his "unicorn," and he even had the kindness to give
Naz the book.
I still have some trouble buying Freddy's character and motivation.
He was kind to Naz, but he was obviously king dog of that prison,
and you don't get to that position by being nice and kind. I kept
expecting him to betray Naz, like Naz's first "friend" in jail did,
but it didn't happen. Freddy's attitude toward Naz just seemed more
poetic than believable.
Freddie wasn't just an altruistic friend, though. He got Naz to commit
felonies for him and got Naz hooked on heroin.
I think he was as altruistic as prison friends get. His corruption of
Naz was his way of bringing Naz into *his* world -- where he was lonely
for quality company. (Remember how he had to hear Naz ask for his
help.) And he had plenty of dumb bodies to do those evil errands...
--
- - - - - - - -
YOUR taste at work...
http://www.moviepig.com
Adam H. Kerman
2016-09-06 14:09:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by moviePig
Post by Micky DuPree
Post by Nil
Post by Robin Miller
I even felt sorry for Freddie, punching that bag so hard because
he had lost his "unicorn," and he even had the kindness to give
Naz the book.
I still have some trouble buying Freddy's character and motivation.
He was kind to Naz, but he was obviously king dog of that prison,
and you don't get to that position by being nice and kind. I kept
expecting him to betray Naz, like Naz's first "friend" in jail did,
but it didn't happen. Freddy's attitude toward Naz just seemed more
poetic than believable.
Freddie wasn't just an altruistic friend, though. He got Naz to commit
felonies for him and got Naz hooked on heroin.
I think he was as altruistic as prison friends get. His corruption of
Naz was his way of bringing Naz into *his* world -- where he was lonely
for quality company. (Remember how he had to hear Naz ask for his
help.) And he had plenty of dumb bodies to do those evil errands...
The word you're desperately searching for is dependency. Omar doesn't
really have friends.
Micky DuPree
2016-09-17 10:55:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by moviePig
Post by Micky DuPree
Post by Nil
I still have some trouble buying Freddy's character and motivation.
He was kind to Naz, but he was obviously king dog of that prison,
and you don't get to that position by being nice and kind. I kept
expecting him to betray Naz, like Naz's first "friend" in jail did,
but it didn't happen. Freddy's attitude toward Naz just seemed more
poetic than believable.
Freddie wasn't just an altruistic friend, though. He got Naz to
commit felonies for him and got Naz hooked on heroin.
I think he was as altruistic as prison friends get.
I can buy that, but ...
Post by moviePig
His corruption of Naz was his way of bringing Naz into *his* world --
where he was lonely for quality company. (Remember how he had to hear
Naz ask for his help.) And he had plenty of dumb bodies to do those
evil errands...
Even so, even the littlest amount of corruption is very disrupting to
someone who's A) innocent and B) going to try to reintegrate back into
civilian life. So I don't have trouble believing Freddie.

-Micky

Bob(but not THAT Bob)
2016-08-30 02:30:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Adam H. Kerman
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Very well done and I was mostly satisfied with the resolution.
The murderer turns out to be Rina E. Ynjfba, someone we never suspected
who wasn't even on Stone's radar. It goes back to the argument that
we knew Andrea had with someone unknown that night, although we didn't
know that Andrea was being followed when she hailed Naz's cab.
Stone really wanted it to be the evil stepfather. There's a nice scene
in which Stone riles him up when he serves the supeona, and then
deliberately enters the courthouse ahead of him, flipping him the bird
as he's getting patted down. He wants this guy to come off as a possibly
dangerous asshole in testimony.
It wasn't til he was on the stand that I recognized him as Mickey Doyle
from Boardwalk Empire!
Post by Adam H. Kerman
Naz told Chandra he wouldn't be cool enough to take the stand and
demands that she buy him drugs. Well, she doesn't just bring him
a sedative, but a pussy-full of sedatives. The two of them think they're
being careful but the evidence of the exchange is caught on tape.
The CD he got was of an earlier session with them kissing - if he'd
gotten that smuggling scene, cutiepie would be going to jail and Naz
would still be inside.
Adam H. Kerman
2016-08-30 02:36:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bob(but not THAT Bob)
Post by Adam H. Kerman
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Very well done and I was mostly satisfied with the resolution.
The murderer turns out to be Rina E. Ynjfba, someone we never suspected
who wasn't even on Stone's radar. It goes back to the argument that
we knew Andrea had with someone unknown that night, although we didn't
know that Andrea was being followed when she hailed Naz's cab.
Stone really wanted it to be the evil stepfather. There's a nice scene
in which Stone riles him up when he serves the supeona, and then
deliberately enters the courthouse ahead of him, flipping him the bird
as he's getting patted down. He wants this guy to come off as a possibly
dangerous asshole in testimony.
It wasn't til he was on the stand that I recognized him as Mickey Doyle
from Boardwalk Empire!
Post by Adam H. Kerman
Naz told Chandra he wouldn't be cool enough to take the stand and
demands that she buy him drugs. Well, she doesn't just bring him
a sedative, but a pussy-full of sedatives. The two of them think they're
being careful but the evidence of the exchange is caught on tape.
The CD he got was of an earlier session with them kissing - if he'd
gotten that smuggling scene, cutiepie would be going to jail and Naz
would still be inside.
Oh. Thanks.
Tom Benton
2016-08-30 10:32:22 UTC
Permalink
On Mon, 29 Aug 2016 22:30:02 -0400, "Bob(but not THAT Bob)"
Post by Bob(but not THAT Bob)
Post by Adam H. Kerman
s
p
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Very well done and I was mostly satisfied with the resolution.
The murderer turns out to be Rina E. Ynjfba, someone we never suspected
who wasn't even on Stone's radar. It goes back to the argument that
we knew Andrea had with someone unknown that night, although we didn't
know that Andrea was being followed when she hailed Naz's cab.
Stone really wanted it to be the evil stepfather. There's a nice scene
in which Stone riles him up when he serves the supeona, and then
deliberately enters the courthouse ahead of him, flipping him the bird
as he's getting patted down. He wants this guy to come off as a possibly
dangerous asshole in testimony.
It wasn't til he was on the stand that I recognized him as Mickey Doyle
from Boardwalk Empire!
Post by Adam H. Kerman
Naz told Chandra he wouldn't be cool enough to take the stand and
demands that she buy him drugs. Well, she doesn't just bring him
a sedative, but a pussy-full of sedatives. The two of them think they're
being careful but the evidence of the exchange is caught on tape.
The CD he got was of an earlier session with them kissing - if he'd
gotten that smuggling scene, cutiepie would be going to jail and Naz
would still be inside.
On a couple of side issues, what is Naz hooked on? I was never sure
what was being smuggled into the prison.

Second, where did Box get the video implicating the financial advisor?
Why didn't this pop before? Did he just try to backtrack her
movements prior to hooking up with Naz?
__________________________________________________


"It's just a flying saucer, Ed...We gotta go!"

Peggy Blumquist
Adam H. Kerman
2016-08-30 13:12:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tom Benton
Post by Bob(but not THAT Bob)
Post by Adam H. Kerman
s
p
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s
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Very well done and I was mostly satisfied with the resolution.
The murderer turns out to be Rina E. Ynjfba, someone we never suspected
who wasn't even on Stone's radar. It goes back to the argument that
we knew Andrea had with someone unknown that night, although we didn't
know that Andrea was being followed when she hailed Naz's cab.
Stone really wanted it to be the evil stepfather. There's a nice scene
in which Stone riles him up when he serves the supeona, and then
deliberately enters the courthouse ahead of him, flipping him the bird
as he's getting patted down. He wants this guy to come off as a possibly
dangerous asshole in testimony.
It wasn't til he was on the stand that I recognized him as Mickey Doyle
from Boardwalk Empire!
Post by Adam H. Kerman
Naz told Chandra he wouldn't be cool enough to take the stand and
demands that she buy him drugs. Well, she doesn't just bring him
a sedative, but a pussy-full of sedatives. The two of them think they're
being careful but the evidence of the exchange is caught on tape.
The CD he got was of an earlier session with them kissing - if he'd
gotten that smuggling scene, cutiepie would be going to jail and Naz
would still be inside.
On a couple of side issues, what is Naz hooked on? I was never sure
what was being smuggled into the prison.
Second, where did Box get the video implicating the financial advisor?
Why didn't this pop before? Did he just try to backtrack her
movements prior to hooking up with Naz?
It's New York City; there are cameras everywhere. The audience is supposed
to believe he just backtracked along possible routes till he found the footage.

It's just a couple of keystrokes.

The convenient solution to the mystery that wasn't the central core of
the program was why I wasn't entirely satisfied with the resolution.
I'd have been happier if there wasn't another prime suspect, given how
little time they spent on it.
moviePig
2016-08-30 13:51:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tom Benton
On Mon, 29 Aug 2016 22:30:02 -0400, "Bob(but not THAT Bob)"
Post by Bob(but not THAT Bob)
Post by Adam H. Kerman
s
p
o
i
l
e
r
s
p
a
c
e
Very well done and I was mostly satisfied with the resolution.
The murderer turns out to be Rina E. Ynjfba, someone we never suspected
who wasn't even on Stone's radar. It goes back to the argument that
we knew Andrea had with someone unknown that night, although we didn't
know that Andrea was being followed when she hailed Naz's cab.
Stone really wanted it to be the evil stepfather. There's a nice scene
in which Stone riles him up when he serves the supeona, and then
deliberately enters the courthouse ahead of him, flipping him the bird
as he's getting patted down. He wants this guy to come off as a possibly
dangerous asshole in testimony.
It wasn't til he was on the stand that I recognized him as Mickey Doyle
from Boardwalk Empire!
Post by Adam H. Kerman
Naz told Chandra he wouldn't be cool enough to take the stand and
demands that she buy him drugs. Well, she doesn't just bring him
a sedative, but a pussy-full of sedatives. The two of them think they're
being careful but the evidence of the exchange is caught on tape.
The CD he got was of an earlier session with them kissing - if he'd
gotten that smuggling scene, cutiepie would be going to jail and Naz
would still be inside.
On a couple of side issues, what is Naz hooked on? I was never sure
what was being smuggled into the prison.
Second, where did Box get the video implicating the financial advisor?
Why didn't this pop before? Did he just try to backtrack her
movements prior to hooking up with Naz?
I think so. And the reason it didn't 'pop before' underscored one of
the defense's big accusations: the cops stopped looking.
--
- - - - - - - -
YOUR taste at work...
http://www.moviepig.com
Adam H. Kerman
2016-08-30 13:59:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by moviePig
Post by Tom Benton
Post by Bob(but not THAT Bob)
Post by Adam H. Kerman
s
p
o
i
l
e
r
s
p
a
c
e
Very well done and I was mostly satisfied with the resolution.
The murderer turns out to be Rina E. Ynjfba, someone we never suspected
who wasn't even on Stone's radar. It goes back to the argument that
we knew Andrea had with someone unknown that night, although we didn't
know that Andrea was being followed when she hailed Naz's cab.
Stone really wanted it to be the evil stepfather. There's a nice scene
in which Stone riles him up when he serves the supeona, and then
deliberately enters the courthouse ahead of him, flipping him the bird
as he's getting patted down. He wants this guy to come off as a possibly
dangerous asshole in testimony.
It wasn't til he was on the stand that I recognized him as Mickey Doyle
from Boardwalk Empire!
Post by Adam H. Kerman
Naz told Chandra he wouldn't be cool enough to take the stand and
demands that she buy him drugs. Well, she doesn't just bring him
a sedative, but a pussy-full of sedatives. The two of them think they're
being careful but the evidence of the exchange is caught on tape.
The CD he got was of an earlier session with them kissing - if he'd
gotten that smuggling scene, cutiepie would be going to jail and Naz
would still be inside.
On a couple of side issues, what is Naz hooked on? I was never sure
what was being smuggled into the prison.
Second, where did Box get the video implicating the financial advisor?
Why didn't this pop before? Did he just try to backtrack her
movements prior to hooking up with Naz?
I think so. And the reason it didn't 'pop before' underscored one of
the defense's big accusations: the cops stopped looking.
Why shouldn't they have? Naz went out of his way to make himself
look guilty. They found what was likely the murder weapon on his person.
Robin Miller
2016-08-30 14:35:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by Adam H. Kerman
Post by moviePig
Post by Tom Benton
Post by Bob(but not THAT Bob)
Post by Adam H. Kerman
s
p
o
i
l
e
r
s
p
a
c
e
Very well done and I was mostly satisfied with the resolution.
The murderer turns out to be Rina E. Ynjfba, someone we never suspected
who wasn't even on Stone's radar. It goes back to the argument that
we knew Andrea had with someone unknown that night, although we didn't
know that Andrea was being followed when she hailed Naz's cab.
Stone really wanted it to be the evil stepfather. There's a nice scene
in which Stone riles him up when he serves the supeona, and then
deliberately enters the courthouse ahead of him, flipping him the bird
as he's getting patted down. He wants this guy to come off as a possibly
dangerous asshole in testimony.
It wasn't til he was on the stand that I recognized him as Mickey Doyle
from Boardwalk Empire!
Post by Adam H. Kerman
Naz told Chandra he wouldn't be cool enough to take the stand and
demands that she buy him drugs. Well, she doesn't just bring him
a sedative, but a pussy-full of sedatives. The two of them think they're
being careful but the evidence of the exchange is caught on tape.
The CD he got was of an earlier session with them kissing - if he'd
gotten that smuggling scene, cutiepie would be going to jail and Naz
would still be inside.
On a couple of side issues, what is Naz hooked on? I was never sure
what was being smuggled into the prison.
Second, where did Box get the video implicating the financial advisor?
Why didn't this pop before? Did he just try to backtrack her
movements prior to hooking up with Naz?
I think so. And the reason it didn't 'pop before' underscored one of
the defense's big accusations: the cops stopped looking.
Why shouldn't they have? Naz went out of his way to make himself
look guilty. They found what was likely the murder weapon on his person.
_Was_ it the murder weapon? Did they ever establish that it could have
caused her wounds, maybe in a conversation with the crooked coroner? I
assume it was the knife that Naz and Andrea used to play their stabbing
game; did the financial advisor come along later and use the same knife
to kill her? Since there was no talk of two knives, I assume this was
the missing knife from the kitchen set, but it wasn't clear to me.

--Robin
suzeeq
2016-08-30 14:59:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Robin Miller
Post by Adam H. Kerman
Post by moviePig
Post by Tom Benton
Post by Bob(but not THAT Bob)
Post by Adam H. Kerman
s
p
o
i
l
e
r
s
p
a
c
e
Very well done and I was mostly satisfied with the resolution.
The murderer turns out to be Rina E. Ynjfba, someone we never suspected
who wasn't even on Stone's radar. It goes back to the argument that
we knew Andrea had with someone unknown that night, although we didn't
know that Andrea was being followed when she hailed Naz's cab.
Stone really wanted it to be the evil stepfather. There's a nice scene
in which Stone riles him up when he serves the supeona, and then
deliberately enters the courthouse ahead of him, flipping him the bird
as he's getting patted down. He wants this guy to come off as a possibly
dangerous asshole in testimony.
It wasn't til he was on the stand that I recognized him as Mickey Doyle
from Boardwalk Empire!
Post by Adam H. Kerman
Naz told Chandra he wouldn't be cool enough to take the stand and
demands that she buy him drugs. Well, she doesn't just bring him
a sedative, but a pussy-full of sedatives. The two of them think they're
being careful but the evidence of the exchange is caught on tape.
The CD he got was of an earlier session with them kissing - if he'd
gotten that smuggling scene, cutiepie would be going to jail and Naz
would still be inside.
On a couple of side issues, what is Naz hooked on? I was never sure
what was being smuggled into the prison.
Second, where did Box get the video implicating the financial advisor?
Why didn't this pop before? Did he just try to backtrack her
movements prior to hooking up with Naz?
I think so. And the reason it didn't 'pop before' underscored one of
the defense's big accusations: the cops stopped looking.
Why shouldn't they have? Naz went out of his way to make himself
look guilty. They found what was likely the murder weapon on his person.
_Was_ it the murder weapon? Did they ever establish that it could have
caused her wounds, maybe in a conversation with the crooked coroner? I
assume it was the knife that Naz and Andrea used to play their stabbing
game; did the financial advisor come along later and use the same knife
to kill her? Since there was no talk of two knives, I assume this was
the missing knife from the kitchen set, but it wasn't clear to me.
--Robin
There was another knife missing from the kitchen besides this one.
Robin Miller
2016-08-30 21:58:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by suzeeq
Post by Robin Miller
Post by Adam H. Kerman
Post by moviePig
Post by Tom Benton
Post by Bob(but not THAT Bob)
Post by Adam H. Kerman
s
p
o
i
l
e
r
s
p
a
c
e
Very well done and I was mostly satisfied with the resolution.
The murderer turns out to be Rina E. Ynjfba, someone we never suspected
who wasn't even on Stone's radar. It goes back to the argument that
we knew Andrea had with someone unknown that night, although we didn't
know that Andrea was being followed when she hailed Naz's cab.
Stone really wanted it to be the evil stepfather. There's a nice scene
in which Stone riles him up when he serves the supeona, and then
deliberately enters the courthouse ahead of him, flipping him the bird
as he's getting patted down. He wants this guy to come off as a possibly
dangerous asshole in testimony.
It wasn't til he was on the stand that I recognized him as Mickey Doyle
from Boardwalk Empire!
Post by Adam H. Kerman
Naz told Chandra he wouldn't be cool enough to take the stand and
demands that she buy him drugs. Well, she doesn't just bring him
a sedative, but a pussy-full of sedatives. The two of them think they're
being careful but the evidence of the exchange is caught on tape.
The CD he got was of an earlier session with them kissing - if he'd
gotten that smuggling scene, cutiepie would be going to jail and Naz
would still be inside.
On a couple of side issues, what is Naz hooked on? I was never sure
what was being smuggled into the prison.
Second, where did Box get the video implicating the financial advisor?
Why didn't this pop before? Did he just try to backtrack her
movements prior to hooking up with Naz?
I think so. And the reason it didn't 'pop before' underscored one of
the defense's big accusations: the cops stopped looking.
Why shouldn't they have? Naz went out of his way to make himself
look guilty. They found what was likely the murder weapon on his person.
_Was_ it the murder weapon? Did they ever establish that it could have
caused her wounds, maybe in a conversation with the crooked coroner? I
assume it was the knife that Naz and Andrea used to play their
stabbing game; did the financial advisor come along later and use the
same knife to kill her? Since there was no talk of two knives, I
assume this was the missing knife from the kitchen set, but it wasn't
clear to me.
--Robin
There was another knife missing from the kitchen besides this one.
Thanks!

--Robin
Adam H. Kerman
2016-08-30 15:53:31 UTC
Permalink
Post by Robin Miller
Post by Adam H. Kerman
Post by moviePig
Post by Tom Benton
Post by Bob(but not THAT Bob)
Post by Adam H. Kerman
s
p
o
i
l
e
r
s
p
a
c
e
Very well done and I was mostly satisfied with the resolution.
The murderer turns out to be Rina E. Ynjfba, someone we never suspected
who wasn't even on Stone's radar. It goes back to the argument that
we knew Andrea had with someone unknown that night, although we didn't
know that Andrea was being followed when she hailed Naz's cab.
Stone really wanted it to be the evil stepfather. There's a nice scene
in which Stone riles him up when he serves the supeona, and then
deliberately enters the courthouse ahead of him, flipping him the bird
as he's getting patted down. He wants this guy to come off as a possibly
dangerous asshole in testimony.
It wasn't til he was on the stand that I recognized him as Mickey Doyle
from Boardwalk Empire!
Post by Adam H. Kerman
Naz told Chandra he wouldn't be cool enough to take the stand and
demands that she buy him drugs. Well, she doesn't just bring him
a sedative, but a pussy-full of sedatives. The two of them think they're
being careful but the evidence of the exchange is caught on tape.
The CD he got was of an earlier session with them kissing - if he'd
gotten that smuggling scene, cutiepie would be going to jail and Naz
would still be inside.
On a couple of side issues, what is Naz hooked on? I was never sure
what was being smuggled into the prison.
Second, where did Box get the video implicating the financial advisor?
Why didn't this pop before? Did he just try to backtrack her
movements prior to hooking up with Naz?
I think so. And the reason it didn't 'pop before' underscored one of
the defense's big accusations: the cops stopped looking.
Why shouldn't they have? Naz went out of his way to make himself
look guilty. They found what was likely the murder weapon on his person.
_Was_ it the murder weapon?
All we know for certain is that it was a common knife that could have been
the murder weapon. It had her blood on it because the two stoned idiots
were playing a stupid game with it and her hand was cut.
Post by Robin Miller
Did they ever establish that it could have caused her wounds, maybe in
a conversation with the crooked coroner?
I assume it was the knife that Naz and Andrea used to play their stabbing
game; did the financial advisor come along later and use the same knife
to kill her?
You know what? Now that I think about it, it could have been the murder
weapon and we don't necessarily know that it was the knife the two idiots
were playing with. The murderer could have relocated it just to cause
trouble, or taken the wrong knife with him.
Post by Robin Miller
Since there was no talk of two knives, I assume this was the missing
knife from the kitchen set, but it wasn't clear to me.
My assumption is that the knife was so common that her mother's kitchen
had more than one of the same knife.

Are we supposed to believe that the murder was premeditated and that the
killer simply brought a common kitchen knife with him? Or did he just
grab it as a convenient weapon?

Was Andrea unconscious when she was murdered? Did she appear to be awake
but in a drug-induced blackout state? Was she fully conscious because she
had a much higher tolerance for the drugs than Naz or because she
took less?

We don't even know if the killer noticed Naz there passed out and attempted
to frame him. It's almost like he never noticed Naz, but I don't know.

So many of the details of the crime weren't established, which I think
was a deliberate choice on the part of the writers.
Robin Miller
2016-08-30 22:00:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by Adam H. Kerman
Post by Robin Miller
Post by Adam H. Kerman
Post by moviePig
Post by Tom Benton
Post by Bob(but not THAT Bob)
Post by Adam H. Kerman
s
p
o
i
l
e
r
s
p
a
c
e
Very well done and I was mostly satisfied with the resolution.
The murderer turns out to be Rina E. Ynjfba, someone we never suspected
who wasn't even on Stone's radar. It goes back to the argument that
we knew Andrea had with someone unknown that night, although we didn't
know that Andrea was being followed when she hailed Naz's cab.
Stone really wanted it to be the evil stepfather. There's a nice scene
in which Stone riles him up when he serves the supeona, and then
deliberately enters the courthouse ahead of him, flipping him the bird
as he's getting patted down. He wants this guy to come off as a possibly
dangerous asshole in testimony.
It wasn't til he was on the stand that I recognized him as Mickey Doyle
from Boardwalk Empire!
Post by Adam H. Kerman
Naz told Chandra he wouldn't be cool enough to take the stand and
demands that she buy him drugs. Well, she doesn't just bring him
a sedative, but a pussy-full of sedatives. The two of them think they're
being careful but the evidence of the exchange is caught on tape.
The CD he got was of an earlier session with them kissing - if he'd
gotten that smuggling scene, cutiepie would be going to jail and Naz
would still be inside.
On a couple of side issues, what is Naz hooked on? I was never sure
what was being smuggled into the prison.
Second, where did Box get the video implicating the financial advisor?
Why didn't this pop before? Did he just try to backtrack her
movements prior to hooking up with Naz?
I think so. And the reason it didn't 'pop before' underscored one of
the defense's big accusations: the cops stopped looking.
Why shouldn't they have? Naz went out of his way to make himself
look guilty. They found what was likely the murder weapon on his person.
_Was_ it the murder weapon?
All we know for certain is that it was a common knife that could have been
the murder weapon. It had her blood on it because the two stoned idiots
were playing a stupid game with it and her hand was cut.
Post by Robin Miller
Did they ever establish that it could have caused her wounds, maybe in
a conversation with the crooked coroner?
I assume it was the knife that Naz and Andrea used to play their stabbing
game; did the financial advisor come along later and use the same knife
to kill her?
You know what? Now that I think about it, it could have been the murder
weapon and we don't necessarily know that it was the knife the two idiots
were playing with. The murderer could have relocated it just to cause
trouble, or taken the wrong knife with him.
Post by Robin Miller
Since there was no talk of two knives, I assume this was the missing
knife from the kitchen set, but it wasn't clear to me.
My assumption is that the knife was so common that her mother's kitchen
had more than one of the same knife.
Are we supposed to believe that the murder was premeditated and that the
killer simply brought a common kitchen knife with him? Or did he just
grab it as a convenient weapon?
Was Andrea unconscious when she was murdered? Did she appear to be awake
but in a drug-induced blackout state? Was she fully conscious because she
had a much higher tolerance for the drugs than Naz or because she
took less?
We don't even know if the killer noticed Naz there passed out and attempted
to frame him. It's almost like he never noticed Naz, but I don't know.
So many of the details of the crime weren't established, which I think
was a deliberate choice on the part of the writers.
Thanks, Adam. Most of the details didn't matter to me, but I kept
wondering whether they even knew that the knife in Naz's pocket was the
murder weapon. I don't remember anything definitive about that, which
was hard to believe, given its crucial importance, as, well, the
supposed murder weapon.

--Robin
Nil
2016-08-30 22:08:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by Robin Miller
Thanks, Adam. Most of the details didn't matter to me, but I kept
wondering whether they even knew that the knife in Naz's pocket
was the murder weapon. I don't remember anything definitive about
that, which was hard to believe, given its crucial importance, as,
well, the supposed murder weapon.
It was assumed by the police that the knife was The Knife, since it was
consistent with the wounds and it was covered with her blood. I would
make that assumption, too, but then I'm not a professional crime
investigator. It did seem to me that the knife had more blood on it
than it should have if it was only used to stick her hand. But of
course, he got more blood on his hand from her body and then handled
the knife.
Barry Margolin
2016-08-31 15:56:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by Nil
Post by Robin Miller
Thanks, Adam. Most of the details didn't matter to me, but I kept
wondering whether they even knew that the knife in Naz's pocket
was the murder weapon. I don't remember anything definitive about
that, which was hard to believe, given its crucial importance, as,
well, the supposed murder weapon.
It was assumed by the police that the knife was The Knife, since it was
consistent with the wounds and it was covered with her blood. I would
make that assumption, too, but then I'm not a professional crime
investigator. It did seem to me that the knife had more blood on it
than it should have if it was only used to stick her hand. But of
course, he got more blood on his hand from her body and then handled
the knife.
One of the main points of this whole series was to show how fucked up
the justice system is. Cops don't go overboard in analyzing the
evidence, if it seems good they go with it. Once they have a reasonable
suspect, they don't go looking for others. Most lawyers are just
working-class slobs like Stone, not rich, highly-educated people like on
"Suits". So unless you're rich enough to afford someone like Harvey
Specter, good luck.

All the evidence against Naz was circumstantial. Did they even have a
motive?
--
Barry Margolin
Arlington, MA
Micky DuPree
2016-09-06 11:15:39 UTC
Permalink
Spoilers for _The Night of_, all episodes.

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Post by Barry Margolin
Post by Nil
Most of the details didn't matter to me, but I kept wondering
whether they even knew that the knife in Naz's pocket was the murder
weapon. I don't remember anything definitive about that, which was
hard to believe, given its crucial importance, as, well, the
supposed murder weapon.
It was assumed by the police that the knife was The Knife, since it
was consistent with the wounds and it was covered with her blood. I
would make that assumption, too, but then I'm not a professional
crime investigator. It did seem to me that the knife had more blood
on it than it should have if it was only used to stick her hand. But
of course, he got more blood on his hand from her body and then
handled the knife.
And Naz put his own blood on the knife once he cut his hand. I'm sure
the police didn't test to see how much of the blood was Naz's and how
much was Andrea's. That would probably be prohibitively expensive to
attempt. Once we found out the knife was part of a set, and we knew
that one of the knives got Andrea's blood on it innocently, it didn't
really matter if that was the murder weapon or not. Maybe there were
two knives with Andrea's blood on them or just the one (maybe the
murderer took the murder weapon with him, not realizing there was a
similar one downstairs). It was thus impossible to use the knife that
Naz took with him to definitely establish anything.
Post by Barry Margolin
One of the main points of this whole series was to show how fucked up
the justice system is. Cops don't go overboard in analyzing the
evidence, if it seems good they go with it.
Yeah, it's not like TV where police departments have unlimited budgets
for lots of tests and forensics almost always establish information with
certainty.

This is a good episode of TruTV's _Adam Ruins Everything_: "Forensic
Science"


Post by Barry Margolin
Once they have a reasonable suspect, they don't go looking for others.
It was chilling how the ADA was just calculating odds of conviction,
which underscores one of the major failings of the American criminal
justice system: the cops and the prosecutors get the same reward for a
bad conviction as they do for a good one. When Box gave her an
alternative suspect, she just said she had more on Naz. The incentive
structure is not pro-justice, just pro-conviction.

Once the jury came back hung, and the ADA realized that even with Naz's
poor performance on the witness stand (a mistake unlikely to be repeated
in a second trial) the case was a loser, only then did she turn her
sights to a another possible avenue towards conviction: Box's newest
suspect.
Post by Barry Margolin
Most lawyers are just working-class slobs like Stone, not rich,
highly-educated people like on "Suits". So unless you're rich enough
to afford someone like Harvey Specter, good luck.
I really miss that short-lived drama _Justice_, where the tag line was
"America has the best justice system money can buy," and the lawyers
often told their clients they didn't even want the clients to tell
them whether they were innocent or guilty. It gave them more latitude
to act.
Post by Barry Margolin
All the evidence against Naz was circumstantial. Did they even have a
motive?
Just that Naz had a history of having a violent temper, and the victim
must have turned him down for sex.

-Micky
Adam H. Kerman
2016-09-06 14:22:20 UTC
Permalink
Post by Micky DuPree
Spoilers for _The Night of_, all episodes.
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. . . One of the main points of this whole series was to show how fucked up
the justice system is. Cops don't go overboard in analyzing the
evidence, if it seems good they go with it.
Yeah, it's not like TV where police departments have unlimited budgets
for lots of tests and forensics almost always establish information with
certainty.
This is a good episode of TruTV's _Adam Ruins Everything_: "Forensic
Science"
http://youtu.be/7H74LO_jERI
Once they have a reasonable suspect, they don't go looking for others.
It was chilling how the ADA was just calculating odds of conviction,
which underscores one of the major failings of the American criminal
justice system: the cops and the prosecutors get the same reward for a
bad conviction as they do for a good one. When Box gave her an
alternative suspect, she just said she had more on Naz. The incentive
structure is not pro-justice, just pro-conviction. . . .
As opposed to what country? In what country do cops identify the prime
suspect then go out of their way to look for evidence to exonnerate him
of the crime?
Post by Micky DuPree
Once the jury came back hung, and the ADA realized that even with Naz's
poor performance on the witness stand (a mistake unlikely to be repeated
in a second trial) the case was a loser, only then did she turn her
sights to a another possible avenue towards conviction: Box's newest
suspect.
Again: It was much more than that. Elaine May's daughter had committed
a serious breach of ethics... which was why Box was so infuriated with her.
That Box had become suspicious enough of Evan R. Lawson to look into his
his movements on The Night Of must be disclosed to the defense.
Post by Micky DuPree
All the evidence against Naz was circumstantial. Did they even have a
motive?
Just that Naz had a history of having a violent temper, and the victim
must have turned him down for sex.
Eh. Naz was provoked, then took his anger out on an unrelated third party.
He didn't have a history of beating up women.

That the victim had turned him down for sex was the legal theory the
prosecution offered the jury. There was no evidence to support the theory,
so the motive was nothing but an unsubstantiated accusation. Given that
it was known that she was the one who had purchased the party drugs, not Naz,
it was a lousy theory.
Micky DuPree
2016-09-06 11:15:03 UTC
Permalink
Spoilers for _The Night of_, all episodes.

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Post by moviePig
Post by Tom Benton
On Mon, 29 Aug 2016 22:30:02 -0400, "Bob(but not THAT Bob)"
Post by Adam H. Kerman
The murderer turns out to be Rina E. Ynjfba, someone we never
suspected who wasn't even on Stone's radar. It goes back to the
argument that we knew Andrea had with someone unknown that night,
although we didn't know that Andrea was being followed when she
hailed Naz's cab.
I'm pretty sure we saw the footage with Andrea looking back over her
shoulder before she got into Naz's cab before, possibly when the ADA
became convinced that that was when Naz chose to murder her. They just
didn't "hang a lantern on it" until Box became intrigued with that
moment enough to try to retrace her steps on video.
Post by moviePig
Post by Tom Benton
Post by Adam H. Kerman
Stone really wanted it to be the evil stepfather. There's a nice
scene in which Stone riles him up when he serves the supeona, and
then deliberately enters the courthouse ahead of him, flipping him
the bird as he's getting patted down. He wants this guy to come off
as a possibly dangerous asshole in testimony.
The stepfather genuinely seemed to be a dangerous asshole. The
stepfather was the percentage guess. The NYPD should check out the
stepfather for being a "black widower."
Post by moviePig
Post by Tom Benton
On a couple of side issues, what is Naz hooked on? I was never sure
what was being smuggled into the prison.
Looked like heroin. Definitely a central nervous system depressant, and
heroin is the most common illicit downer powder to get smoked.
Post by moviePig
Post by Tom Benton
Second, where did Box get the video implicating the financial
advisor? Why didn't this pop before? Did he just try to backtrack
her movements prior to hooking up with Naz?
I think so.
Yes. They did devote some screen time to Box looking over the footage
they started with, noticing that Andrea was checking back over her
shoulder before she got into Naz's cab. Box backtracked from there to
retrace her path, finding her emerging from a restaurant with a man
following behind. The restaurant led to credit card receipts. The
receipts led to a friend of Box's running the credit card numbers
illegally. By cross-refencing the credit card holders with the phone
numbers on Andrea's phone bill, he came up with a name: the investment
guy's.
Post by moviePig
And the reason it didn't 'pop before' underscored one of the defense's
big accusations: the cops stopped looking.
My understanding is that this is how it is in real life. Once the
authorities have someone they think they can get a conviction on, they
stop looking.

Once the irregularities in the stepfather's life came to light, a
reasonable person would at least want to know more, but the cops can't
go there because they might find more evidence that would create
reasonable doubt in Naz's case, which they would be legally required to
share with the defense. Therefore they frankly don't want to know more.

-Micky
suzeeq
2016-09-06 15:18:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by Micky DuPree
Spoilers for _The Night of_, all episodes.
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.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
Post by moviePig
Post by Tom Benton
On Mon, 29 Aug 2016 22:30:02 -0400, "Bob(but not THAT Bob)"
Post by Adam H. Kerman
The murderer turns out to be Rina E. Ynjfba, someone we never
suspected who wasn't even on Stone's radar. It goes back to the
argument that we knew Andrea had with someone unknown that night,
although we didn't know that Andrea was being followed when she
hailed Naz's cab.
I'm pretty sure we saw the footage with Andrea looking back over her
shoulder before she got into Naz's cab before, possibly when the ADA
became convinced that that was when Naz chose to murder her. They just
didn't "hang a lantern on it" until Box became intrigued with that
moment enough to try to retrace her steps on video.
Post by moviePig
Post by Tom Benton
Post by Adam H. Kerman
Stone really wanted it to be the evil stepfather. There's a nice
scene in which Stone riles him up when he serves the supeona, and
then deliberately enters the courthouse ahead of him, flipping him
the bird as he's getting patted down. He wants this guy to come off
as a possibly dangerous asshole in testimony.
The stepfather genuinely seemed to be a dangerous asshole. The
stepfather was the percentage guess. The NYPD should check out the
stepfather for being a "black widower."
Post by moviePig
Post by Tom Benton
On a couple of side issues, what is Naz hooked on? I was never sure
what was being smuggled into the prison.
Looked like heroin. Definitely a central nervous system depressant, and
heroin is the most common illicit downer powder to get smoked.
Crack has a similar effect.
Post by Micky DuPree
Post by moviePig
Post by Tom Benton
Second, where did Box get the video implicating the financial
advisor? Why didn't this pop before? Did he just try to backtrack
her movements prior to hooking up with Naz?
I think so.
Yes. They did devote some screen time to Box looking over the footage
they started with, noticing that Andrea was checking back over her
shoulder before she got into Naz's cab. Box backtracked from there to
retrace her path, finding her emerging from a restaurant with a man
following behind. The restaurant led to credit card receipts. The
receipts led to a friend of Box's running the credit card numbers
illegally. By cross-refencing the credit card holders with the phone
numbers on Andrea's phone bill, he came up with a name: the investment
guy's.
Post by moviePig
And the reason it didn't 'pop before' underscored one of the defense's
big accusations: the cops stopped looking.
My understanding is that this is how it is in real life. Once the
authorities have someone they think they can get a conviction on, they
stop looking.
Once the irregularities in the stepfather's life came to light, a
reasonable person would at least want to know more, but the cops can't
go there because they might find more evidence that would create
reasonable doubt in Naz's case, which they would be legally required to
share with the defense. Therefore they frankly don't want to know more.
Yup.
suzeeq
2016-08-30 14:57:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tom Benton
On Mon, 29 Aug 2016 22:30:02 -0400, "Bob(but not THAT Bob)"
Post by Bob(but not THAT Bob)
Post by Adam H. Kerman
s
p
o
i
l
e
r
s
p
a
c
e
Very well done and I was mostly satisfied with the resolution.
The murderer turns out to be Rina E. Ynjfba, someone we never suspected
who wasn't even on Stone's radar. It goes back to the argument that
we knew Andrea had with someone unknown that night, although we didn't
know that Andrea was being followed when she hailed Naz's cab.
Stone really wanted it to be the evil stepfather. There's a nice scene
in which Stone riles him up when he serves the supeona, and then
deliberately enters the courthouse ahead of him, flipping him the bird
as he's getting patted down. He wants this guy to come off as a possibly
dangerous asshole in testimony.
It wasn't til he was on the stand that I recognized him as Mickey Doyle
from Boardwalk Empire!
Post by Adam H. Kerman
Naz told Chandra he wouldn't be cool enough to take the stand and
demands that she buy him drugs. Well, she doesn't just bring him
a sedative, but a pussy-full of sedatives. The two of them think they're
being careful but the evidence of the exchange is caught on tape.
The CD he got was of an earlier session with them kissing - if he'd
gotten that smuggling scene, cutiepie would be going to jail and Naz
would still be inside.
On a couple of side issues, what is Naz hooked on? I was never sure
what was being smuggled into the prison.
Crack.
Post by Tom Benton
Second, where did Box get the video implicating the financial advisor?
Why didn't this pop before? Did he just try to backtrack her
movements prior to hooking up with Naz?
No one ever looked for anything in her personal life before.
Adam H. Kerman
2016-08-30 15:55:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by suzeeq
Post by Tom Benton
Post by Bob(but not THAT Bob)
Post by Adam H. Kerman
s
p
o
i
l
e
r
s
p
a
c
e
Very well done and I was mostly satisfied with the resolution.
The murderer turns out to be Rina E. Ynjfba, someone we never suspected
who wasn't even on Stone's radar. It goes back to the argument that
we knew Andrea had with someone unknown that night, although we didn't
know that Andrea was being followed when she hailed Naz's cab.
Stone really wanted it to be the evil stepfather. There's a nice scene
in which Stone riles him up when he serves the supeona, and then
deliberately enters the courthouse ahead of him, flipping him the bird
as he's getting patted down. He wants this guy to come off as a possibly
dangerous asshole in testimony.
It wasn't til he was on the stand that I recognized him as Mickey Doyle
from Boardwalk Empire!
Post by Adam H. Kerman
Naz told Chandra he wouldn't be cool enough to take the stand and
demands that she buy him drugs. Well, she doesn't just bring him
a sedative, but a pussy-full of sedatives. The two of them think they're
being careful but the evidence of the exchange is caught on tape.
The CD he got was of an earlier session with them kissing - if he'd
gotten that smuggling scene, cutiepie would be going to jail and Naz
would still be inside.
On a couple of side issues, what is Naz hooked on? I was never sure
what was being smuggled into the prison.
Crack.
Post by Tom Benton
Second, where did Box get the video implicating the financial advisor?
Why didn't this pop before? Did he just try to backtrack her
movements prior to hooking up with Naz?
No one ever looked for anything in her personal life before.
Stone did. Stone did a hell of a lot more investigating than anyone else.
suzeeq
2016-08-30 16:39:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by Adam H. Kerman
Post by suzeeq
Post by Tom Benton
Post by Bob(but not THAT Bob)
Post by Adam H. Kerman
s
p
o
i
l
e
r
s
p
a
c
e
Very well done and I was mostly satisfied with the resolution.
The murderer turns out to be Rina E. Ynjfba, someone we never suspected
who wasn't even on Stone's radar. It goes back to the argument that
we knew Andrea had with someone unknown that night, although we didn't
know that Andrea was being followed when she hailed Naz's cab.
Stone really wanted it to be the evil stepfather. There's a nice scene
in which Stone riles him up when he serves the supeona, and then
deliberately enters the courthouse ahead of him, flipping him the bird
as he's getting patted down. He wants this guy to come off as a possibly
dangerous asshole in testimony.
It wasn't til he was on the stand that I recognized him as Mickey Doyle
from Boardwalk Empire!
Post by Adam H. Kerman
Naz told Chandra he wouldn't be cool enough to take the stand and
demands that she buy him drugs. Well, she doesn't just bring him
a sedative, but a pussy-full of sedatives. The two of them think they're
being careful but the evidence of the exchange is caught on tape.
The CD he got was of an earlier session with them kissing - if he'd
gotten that smuggling scene, cutiepie would be going to jail and Naz
would still be inside.
On a couple of side issues, what is Naz hooked on? I was never sure
what was being smuggled into the prison.
Crack.
Post by Tom Benton
Second, where did Box get the video implicating the financial advisor?
Why didn't this pop before? Did he just try to backtrack her
movements prior to hooking up with Naz?
No one ever looked for anything in her personal life before.
Stone did. Stone did a hell of a lot more investigating than anyone else.
True, he just didn't have access to the CCTV cameras. By 'no one' I
meant the cops.
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