Discussion:
Snopes Finally Debunks Left-Wing Claim of "Very Fine People" in Charlottesville
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BTR1701
2024-06-28 19:15:37 UTC
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It's seven years after the fact and the damage has long since been done, bu
the left-wing fact checkers at Snopes have finally come out and admitted th
whole claim that Trump called neo-Nazis "very fine people" was a hoax. I hav
no idea why, but credit where it's due, I suppose?

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-people/
Adam H. Kerman
2024-06-28 19:39:52 UTC
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Permalink
It's seven years after the fact and the damage has long since been done, but
the left-wing fact checkers at Snopes have finally come out and admitted the
whole claim that Trump called neo-Nazis "very fine people" was a hoax. I have
no idea why, but credit where it's due, I suppose?
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-people/
Eh

It's another example of the more Trump talked, the more he buried
himself. There was no way for him to win. He should have ignored it, or
limited his comments to condemning the murder.

I don't put the "let's go beat up Nazis" counterprotestors on a high
moral plane. As far as I could tell, the protestors on both sides had
pretty low morals.

I've personally objected to the removal of Civil War monuments making
the generals god-like, but MY reason is rather different than the
neo-Nazis: I don't think the modern generation should be re-writing
history. A past generation erected those monuments and we need to look
the ugliness of American history square in the face so we never forget
that Civil War generals were honored by certain Americans for the modern
politics of that era.

I despite prettying up history. Trump was still wrong.
BTR1701
2024-06-28 19:53:42 UTC
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Permalink
Post by Adam H. Kerman
It's seven years after the fact and the damage has long since been done, but
the left-wing fact checkers at Snopes have finally come out and admitted the
whole claim that Trump called neo-Nazis "very fine people" was a hoax. I have
no idea why, but credit where it's due, I suppose?
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-people/
Eh
It's another example of the more Trump talked, the more he buried
himself. There was no way for him to win. He should have ignored it, or
limited his comments to condemning the murder.
This is only important in as much as it's the final nail in the coffin
of Snopes as some sort of authoritative unbiased fact-checking
organization.

Snopes is a cheerleader for the Left and this is Exhibit A as proof.
moviePig
2024-06-28 20:41:52 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by BTR1701
Post by Adam H. Kerman
It's seven years after the fact and the damage has long since been done, but
the left-wing fact checkers at Snopes have finally come out and admitted the
whole claim that Trump called neo-Nazis "very fine people" was a hoax. I have
no idea why, but credit where it's due, I suppose?
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-people/
Eh
It's another example of the more Trump talked, the more he buried
himself. There was no way for him to win. He should have ignored it, or
limited his comments to condemning the murder.
This is only important in as much as it's the final nail in the coffin
of Snopes as some sort of authoritative unbiased fact-checking
organization.
Snopes is a cheerleader for the Left and this is Exhibit A as proof.
How is Snopes's self-correction cheerleading for the Left?
trotsky
2024-06-29 16:21:04 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by moviePig
Post by BTR1701
Post by Adam H. Kerman
It's seven years after the fact and the damage has long since been done, but
the left-wing fact checkers at Snopes have finally come out and admitted the
whole claim that Trump called neo-Nazis "very fine people" was a hoax. I have
no idea why, but credit where it's due, I suppose?
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-people/
Eh
It's another example of the more Trump talked, the more he buried
himself. There was no way for him to win. He should have ignored it, or
limited his comments to condemning the murder.
This is only important in as much as it's the final nail in the coffin
of Snopes as some sort of authoritative unbiased fact-checking
organization.
Snopes is a cheerleader for the Left and this is Exhibit A as proof.
How is Snopes's self-correction cheerleading for the Left?
Snopes jumped the shark in that article and it's unclear why. It
doesn't even seem like them it seems like right wing asshole spoofing them.
shawn
2024-06-28 21:10:07 UTC
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Permalink
On Fri, 28 Jun 2024 19:39:52 -0000 (UTC), "Adam H. Kerman"
Post by Adam H. Kerman
It's seven years after the fact and the damage has long since been done, but
the left-wing fact checkers at Snopes have finally come out and admitted the
whole claim that Trump called neo-Nazis "very fine people" was a hoax. I have
no idea why, but credit where it's due, I suppose?
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-people/
Eh
It's another example of the more Trump talked, the more he buried
himself. There was no way for him to win. He should have ignored it, or
limited his comments to condemning the murder.
I don't put the "let's go beat up Nazis" counterprotestors on a high
moral plane. As far as I could tell, the protestors on both sides had
pretty low morals.
I've personally objected to the removal of Civil War monuments making
the generals god-like, but MY reason is rather different than the
neo-Nazis: I don't think the modern generation should be re-writing
history. A past generation erected those monuments and we need to look
the ugliness of American history square in the face so we never forget
that Civil War generals were honored by certain Americans for the modern
politics of that era.
People are worried about those statues glorifying the actions of those
people. I don't think the reasons behind the erecting of the statues
or the timing is brought up that often. Certainly I never knew growing
up the time frame for the erecting of the statues or the actual
reasons behind it. It would be better to have kept the statues and put
more effort into teaching the history behind their erection.

Not that I think it would change things as it seems most people forget
what little bit of history they get taught in school not long after
leaving school.
Post by Adam H. Kerman
I despite prettying up history. Trump was still wrong.
Agreed. History is full of ugly moments that are best remembered in
the hopes that we don't repeat them.
Adam H. Kerman
2024-06-28 21:16:23 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by shawn
Post by Adam H. Kerman
It's seven years after the fact and the damage has long since been done, but
the left-wing fact checkers at Snopes have finally come out and admitted the
whole claim that Trump called neo-Nazis "very fine people" was a hoax. I have
no idea why, but credit where it's due, I suppose?
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-people/
Eh
It's another example of the more Trump talked, the more he buried
himself. There was no way for him to win. He should have ignored it, or
limited his comments to condemning the murder.
I don't put the "let's go beat up Nazis" counterprotestors on a high
moral plane. As far as I could tell, the protestors on both sides had
pretty low morals.
I've personally objected to the removal of Civil War monuments making
the generals god-like, but MY reason is rather different than the
neo-Nazis: I don't think the modern generation should be re-writing
history. A past generation erected those monuments and we need to look
the ugliness of American history square in the face so we never forget
that Civil War generals were honored by certain Americans for the modern
politics of that era.
People are worried about those statues glorifying the actions of those
people. I don't think the reasons behind the erecting of the statues
or the timing is brought up that often.
Erecting a monument is always about contemporary politics; the honor to
the subject of the monument is a secondary consideration. In this case,
it was either to enforce politics of the Jim Crow era, or since the
1950s, to deny federal desegregation efforts.

It wasn't about military history.
Post by shawn
Certainly I never knew growing
up the time frame for the erecting of the statues or the actual
reasons behind it. It would be better to have kept the statues and put
more effort into teaching the history behind their erection.
Sure.

Let's always remember the greatness of the antebellum South, even if we
must heavily fictionalize it, for it existed for all too fleeting a
period and is Gone With the Wind.

I'm not getting the movie quote quite right.
Post by shawn
Not that I think it would change things as it seems most people forget
what little bit of history they get taught in school not long after
leaving school.
Post by Adam H. Kerman
I despite prettying up history. Trump was still wrong.
Agreed. History is full of ugly moments that are best remembered in
the hopes that we don't repeat them.
moviePig
2024-06-28 22:22:14 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by shawn
On Fri, 28 Jun 2024 19:39:52 -0000 (UTC), "Adam H. Kerman"
Post by Adam H. Kerman
It's seven years after the fact and the damage has long since been done, but
the left-wing fact checkers at Snopes have finally come out and admitted the
whole claim that Trump called neo-Nazis "very fine people" was a hoax. I have
no idea why, but credit where it's due, I suppose?
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-people/
Eh
It's another example of the more Trump talked, the more he buried
himself. There was no way for him to win. He should have ignored it, or
limited his comments to condemning the murder.
I don't put the "let's go beat up Nazis" counterprotestors on a high
moral plane. As far as I could tell, the protestors on both sides had
pretty low morals.
I've personally objected to the removal of Civil War monuments making
the generals god-like, but MY reason is rather different than the
neo-Nazis: I don't think the modern generation should be re-writing
history. A past generation erected those monuments and we need to look
the ugliness of American history square in the face so we never forget
that Civil War generals were honored by certain Americans for the modern
politics of that era.
People are worried about those statues glorifying the actions of those
people. I don't think the reasons behind the erecting of the statues
or the timing is brought up that often. Certainly I never knew growing
up the time frame for the erecting of the statues or the actual
reasons behind it. It would be better to have kept the statues and put
more effort into teaching the history behind their erection.
Not that I think it would change things as it seems most people forget
what little bit of history they get taught in school not long after
leaving school.
Post by Adam H. Kerman
I despite prettying up history. Trump was still wrong.
Agreed. History is full of ugly moments that are best remembered in
the hopes that we don't repeat them.
A descriptive plaque with any such statue would seem to be so obvious a
solution that you have to wonder if both sides vehemently oppose it.
trotsky
2024-06-29 16:22:35 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by moviePig
Post by shawn
On Fri, 28 Jun 2024 19:39:52 -0000 (UTC), "Adam H. Kerman"
Post by Adam H. Kerman
It's seven years after the fact and the damage has long since been done, but
the left-wing fact checkers at Snopes have finally come out and admitted the
whole claim that Trump called neo-Nazis "very fine people" was a hoax. I have
no idea why, but credit where it's due, I suppose?
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-people/
Eh
It's another example of the more Trump talked, the more he buried
himself. There was no way for him to win. He should have ignored it, or
limited his comments to condemning the murder.
I don't put the "let's go beat up Nazis" counterprotestors on a high
moral plane. As far as I could tell, the protestors on both sides had
pretty low morals.
I've personally objected to the removal of Civil War monuments making
the generals god-like, but MY reason is rather different than the
neo-Nazis: I don't think the modern generation should be re-writing
history. A past generation erected those monuments and we need to look
the ugliness of American history square in the face so we never forget
that Civil War generals were honored by certain Americans for the modern
politics of that era.
People are worried about those statues glorifying the actions of those
people. I don't think the reasons behind the erecting of the statues
or the timing is brought up that often. Certainly I never knew growing
up the time frame for the erecting of the statues or the actual
reasons behind it. It would be better to have kept the statues and put
more effort into teaching the history behind their erection.
Not that I think it would change things as it seems most people forget
what little bit of history they get taught in school not long after
leaving school.
Post by Adam H. Kerman
I despite prettying up history. Trump was still wrong.
Agreed. History is full of ugly moments that are best remembered in
the hopes that we don't repeat them.
A descriptive plaque with any such statue would seem to be so obvious a
solution that you have to wonder if both sides vehemently oppose it.
We don't need statues to learn history.
moviePig
2024-06-29 17:01:52 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by trotsky
Post by moviePig
Post by shawn
On Fri, 28 Jun 2024 19:39:52 -0000 (UTC), "Adam H. Kerman"
Post by Adam H. Kerman
It's seven years after the fact and the damage has long since been done, but
the left-wing fact checkers at Snopes have finally come out and admitted the
whole claim that Trump called neo-Nazis "very fine people" was a hoax. I have
no idea why, but credit where it's due, I suppose?
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-people/
Eh
It's another example of the more Trump talked, the more he buried
himself. There was no way for him to win. He should have ignored it, or
limited his comments to condemning the murder.
I don't put the "let's go beat up Nazis" counterprotestors on a high
moral plane. As far as I could tell, the protestors on both sides had
pretty low morals.
I've personally objected to the removal of Civil War monuments making
the generals god-like, but MY reason is rather different than the
neo-Nazis: I don't think the modern generation should be re-writing
history. A past generation erected those monuments and we need to look
the ugliness of American history square in the face so we never forget
that Civil War generals were honored by certain Americans for the modern
politics of that era.
People are worried about those statues glorifying the actions of those
people. I don't think the reasons behind the erecting of the statues
or the timing is brought up that often. Certainly I never knew growing
up the time frame for the erecting of the statues or the actual
reasons behind it. It would be better to have kept the statues and put
more effort into teaching the history behind their erection.
Not that I think it would change things as it seems most people forget
what little bit of history they get taught in school not long after
leaving school.
Post by Adam H. Kerman
I despite prettying up history. Trump was still wrong.
Agreed. History is full of ugly moments that are best remembered in
the hopes that we don't repeat them.
A descriptive plaque with any such statue would seem to be so obvious
a solution that you have to wonder if both sides vehemently oppose it.
We don't need statues to learn history.
In fact, these statues seem to be about forgetting it...
moviePig
2024-06-29 17:15:35 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by moviePig
Post by trotsky
Post by moviePig
Post by shawn
On Fri, 28 Jun 2024 19:39:52 -0000 (UTC), "Adam H. Kerman"
Post by Adam H. Kerman
It's seven years after the fact and the damage has long since been done, but
the left-wing fact checkers at Snopes have finally come out and admitted the
whole claim that Trump called neo-Nazis "very fine people" was a hoax. I have
no idea why, but credit where it's due, I suppose?
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-people/
Eh
It's another example of the more Trump talked, the more he buried
himself. There was no way for him to win. He should have ignored it, or
limited his comments to condemning the murder.
I don't put the "let's go beat up Nazis" counterprotestors on a high
moral plane. As far as I could tell, the protestors on both sides had
pretty low morals.
I've personally objected to the removal of Civil War monuments making
the generals god-like, but MY reason is rather different than the
neo-Nazis: I don't think the modern generation should be re-writing
history. A past generation erected those monuments and we need to look
the ugliness of American history square in the face so we never forget
that Civil War generals were honored by certain Americans for the modern
politics of that era.
People are worried about those statues glorifying the actions of those
people. I don't think the reasons behind the erecting of the statues
or the timing is brought up that often. Certainly I never knew growing
up the time frame for the erecting of the statues or the actual
reasons behind it. It would be better to have kept the statues and put
more effort into teaching the history behind their erection.
Not that I think it would change things as it seems most people forget
what little bit of history they get taught in school not long after
leaving school.
Post by Adam H. Kerman
I despite prettying up history. Trump was still wrong.
Agreed. History is full of ugly moments that are best remembered in
the hopes that we don't repeat them.
A descriptive plaque with any such statue would seem to be so obvious
a solution that you have to wonder if both sides vehemently oppose it.
We don't need statues to learn history.
In fact, these statues seem to be about forgetting it...
Also: my point is that, even if Trump had said verbatim "Nazis are fine
people", it'd be defensible as a (non-Freudian) slip of the tongue
...because Trump simply isn't suicidal. And, trying to indict him on
such weak claims only undercuts the many strong ones.
trotsky
2024-06-30 10:55:40 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by moviePig
Post by moviePig
Post by trotsky
Post by moviePig
Post by shawn
On Fri, 28 Jun 2024 19:39:52 -0000 (UTC), "Adam H. Kerman"
Post by Adam H. Kerman
It's seven years after the fact and the damage has long since been done, but
the left-wing fact checkers at Snopes have finally come out and admitted the
whole claim that Trump called neo-Nazis "very fine people" was a hoax. I have
no idea why, but credit where it's due, I suppose?
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-people/
Eh
It's another example of the more Trump talked, the more he buried
himself. There was no way for him to win. He should have ignored it, or
limited his comments to condemning the murder.
I don't put the "let's go beat up Nazis" counterprotestors on a high
moral plane. As far as I could tell, the protestors on both sides had
pretty low morals.
I've personally objected to the removal of Civil War monuments making
the generals god-like, but MY reason is rather different than the
neo-Nazis: I don't think the modern generation should be re-writing
history. A past generation erected those monuments and we need to look
the ugliness of American history square in the face so we never forget
that Civil War generals were honored by certain Americans for the modern
politics of that era.
People are worried about those statues glorifying the actions of those
people. I don't think the reasons behind the erecting of the statues
or the timing is brought up that often. Certainly I never knew growing
up the time frame for the erecting of the statues or the actual
reasons behind it. It would be better to have kept the statues and put
more effort into teaching the history behind their erection.
Not that I think it would change things as it seems most people forget
what little bit of history they get taught in school not long after
leaving school.
Post by Adam H. Kerman
I despite prettying up history. Trump was still wrong.
Agreed. History is full of ugly moments that are best remembered in
the hopes that we don't repeat them.
A descriptive plaque with any such statue would seem to be so
obvious a solution that you have to wonder if both sides vehemently
oppose it.
We don't need statues to learn history.
In fact, these statues seem to be about forgetting it...
Also: my point is that, even if Trump had said verbatim "Nazis are fine
people", it'd be defensible as a (non-Freudian) slip of the tongue
...because Trump simply isn't suicidal.  And, trying to indict him on
such weak claims only undercuts the many strong ones.
None of what you said has anything to do with the facts in evidence.
moviePig
2024-06-30 16:29:30 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by trotsky
Post by moviePig
Post by moviePig
Post by trotsky
Post by moviePig
Post by shawn
On Fri, 28 Jun 2024 19:39:52 -0000 (UTC), "Adam H. Kerman"
Post by Adam H. Kerman
It's seven years after the fact and the damage has long since been done, but
the left-wing fact checkers at Snopes have finally come out and admitted the
whole claim that Trump called neo-Nazis "very fine people" was a hoax. I have
no idea why, but credit where it's due, I suppose?
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-people/
Eh
It's another example of the more Trump talked, the more he buried
himself. There was no way for him to win. He should have ignored it, or
limited his comments to condemning the murder.
I don't put the "let's go beat up Nazis" counterprotestors on a high
moral plane. As far as I could tell, the protestors on both sides had
pretty low morals.
I've personally objected to the removal of Civil War monuments making
the generals god-like, but MY reason is rather different than the
neo-Nazis: I don't think the modern generation should be re-writing
history. A past generation erected those monuments and we need to look
the ugliness of American history square in the face so we never forget
that Civil War generals were honored by certain Americans for the modern
politics of that era.
People are worried about those statues glorifying the actions of those
people. I don't think the reasons behind the erecting of the statues
or the timing is brought up that often. Certainly I never knew growing
up the time frame for the erecting of the statues or the actual
reasons behind it. It would be better to have kept the statues and put
more effort into teaching the history behind their erection.
Not that I think it would change things as it seems most people forget
what little bit of history they get taught in school not long after
leaving school.
Post by Adam H. Kerman
I despite prettying up history. Trump was still wrong.
Agreed. History is full of ugly moments that are best remembered in
the hopes that we don't repeat them.
A descriptive plaque with any such statue would seem to be so
obvious a solution that you have to wonder if both sides vehemently
oppose it.
We don't need statues to learn history.
In fact, these statues seem to be about forgetting it...
Also: my point is that, even if Trump had said verbatim "Nazis are
fine people", it'd be defensible as a (non-Freudian) slip of the
tongue ...because Trump simply isn't suicidal.  And, trying to indict
him on such weak claims only undercuts the many strong ones.
None of what you said has anything to do with the facts in evidence.
The fact is that even if there were a video of Trump saying "Nazis are
fine people" (which, afaik, there isn't) it would beggar plausibility.
trotsky
2024-06-30 20:30:37 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by moviePig
Post by trotsky
Post by moviePig
Post by moviePig
Post by trotsky
Post by moviePig
Post by shawn
On Fri, 28 Jun 2024 19:39:52 -0000 (UTC), "Adam H. Kerman"
Post by Adam H. Kerman
Post by BTR1701
It's seven years after the fact and the damage has long since
been done, but
the left-wing fact checkers at Snopes have finally come out and
admitted the
whole claim that Trump called neo-Nazis "very fine people" was
a hoax. I have
no idea why, but credit where it's due, I suppose?
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-people/
Eh
It's another example of the more Trump talked, the more he buried
himself. There was no way for him to win. He should have ignored it, or
limited his comments to condemning the murder.
I don't put the "let's go beat up Nazis" counterprotestors on a high
moral plane. As far as I could tell, the protestors on both sides had
pretty low morals.
I've personally objected to the removal of Civil War monuments making
the generals god-like, but MY reason is rather different than the
neo-Nazis: I don't think the modern generation should be re-writing
history. A past generation erected those monuments and we need to look
the ugliness of American history square in the face so we never forget
that Civil War generals were honored by certain Americans for the modern
politics of that era.
People are worried about those statues glorifying the actions of those
people. I don't think the reasons behind the erecting of the statues
or the timing is brought up that often. Certainly I never knew growing
up the time frame for the erecting of the statues or the actual
reasons behind it. It would be better to have kept the statues and put
more effort into teaching the history behind their erection.
Not that I think it would change things as it seems most people forget
what little bit of history they get taught in school not long after
leaving school.
Post by Adam H. Kerman
I despite prettying up history. Trump was still wrong.
Agreed. History is full of ugly moments that are best remembered in
the hopes that we don't repeat them.
A descriptive plaque with any such statue would seem to be so
obvious a solution that you have to wonder if both sides
vehemently oppose it.
We don't need statues to learn history.
In fact, these statues seem to be about forgetting it...
Also: my point is that, even if Trump had said verbatim "Nazis are
fine people", it'd be defensible as a (non-Freudian) slip of the
tongue ...because Trump simply isn't suicidal.  And, trying to indict
him on such weak claims only undercuts the many strong ones.
None of what you said has anything to do with the facts in evidence.
The fact is that even if there were a video of Trump saying "Nazis are
fine people" (which, afaik, there isn't) it would beggar plausibility.
He said there are fine people on both sides. Why don't you get what the
discussion is about?
moviePig
2024-06-30 21:12:53 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by moviePig
Post by trotsky
Post by moviePig
Post by moviePig
Post by trotsky
Post by moviePig
Post by shawn
On Fri, 28 Jun 2024 19:39:52 -0000 (UTC), "Adam H. Kerman"
Post by Adam H. Kerman
Post by BTR1701
It's seven years after the fact and the damage has long since
been done, but
the left-wing fact checkers at Snopes have finally come out
and admitted the
whole claim that Trump called neo-Nazis "very fine people" was
a hoax. I have
no idea why, but credit where it's due, I suppose?
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-people/
Eh
It's another example of the more Trump talked, the more he buried
himself. There was no way for him to win. He should have ignored it, or
limited his comments to condemning the murder.
I don't put the "let's go beat up Nazis" counterprotestors on a high
moral plane. As far as I could tell, the protestors on both sides had
pretty low morals.
I've personally objected to the removal of Civil War monuments making
the generals god-like, but MY reason is rather different than the
neo-Nazis: I don't think the modern generation should be re-writing
history. A past generation erected those monuments and we need to look
the ugliness of American history square in the face so we never forget
that Civil War generals were honored by certain Americans for the modern
politics of that era.
People are worried about those statues glorifying the actions of those
people. I don't think the reasons behind the erecting of the statues
or the timing is brought up that often. Certainly I never knew growing
up the time frame for the erecting of the statues or the actual
reasons behind it. It would be better to have kept the statues and put
more effort into teaching the history behind their erection.
Not that I think it would change things as it seems most people forget
what little bit of history they get taught in school not long after
leaving school.
Post by Adam H. Kerman
I despite prettying up history. Trump was still wrong.
Agreed. History is full of ugly moments that are best remembered in
the hopes that we don't repeat them.
A descriptive plaque with any such statue would seem to be so
obvious a solution that you have to wonder if both sides
vehemently oppose it.
We don't need statues to learn history.
In fact, these statues seem to be about forgetting it...
Also: my point is that, even if Trump had said verbatim "Nazis are
fine people", it'd be defensible as a (non-Freudian) slip of the
tongue ...because Trump simply isn't suicidal.  And, trying to
indict him on such weak claims only undercuts the many strong ones.
None of what you said has anything to do with the facts in evidence.
The fact is that even if there were a video of Trump saying "Nazis are
fine people" (which, afaik, there isn't) it would beggar plausibility.
He said there are fine people on both sides.  Why don't you get what the
discussion is about?
Yes, but the two sides weren't "Nazis" and "non-Nazis". (Yes, I know
that all the Nazis were on only one of the sides.)
trotsky
2024-07-01 09:12:51 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by moviePig
Post by trotsky
Post by moviePig
Post by moviePig
Post by trotsky
Post by moviePig
Post by shawn
On Fri, 28 Jun 2024 19:39:52 -0000 (UTC), "Adam H. Kerman"
Post by Adam H. Kerman
Post by BTR1701
It's seven years after the fact and the damage has long since
been done, but
the left-wing fact checkers at Snopes have finally come out
and admitted the
whole claim that Trump called neo-Nazis "very fine people"
was a hoax. I have
no idea why, but credit where it's due, I suppose?
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-people/
Eh
It's another example of the more Trump talked, the more he buried
himself. There was no way for him to win. He should have ignored it, or
limited his comments to condemning the murder.
I don't put the "let's go beat up Nazis" counterprotestors on a high
moral plane. As far as I could tell, the protestors on both sides had
pretty low morals.
I've personally objected to the removal of Civil War monuments making
the generals god-like, but MY reason is rather different than the
neo-Nazis: I don't think the modern generation should be re-writing
history. A past generation erected those monuments and we need to look
the ugliness of American history square in the face so we never forget
that Civil War generals were honored by certain Americans for the modern
politics of that era.
People are worried about those statues glorifying the actions of those
people. I don't think the reasons behind the erecting of the statues
or the timing is brought up that often. Certainly I never knew growing
up the time frame for the erecting of the statues or the actual
reasons behind it. It would be better to have kept the statues and put
more effort into teaching the history behind their erection.
Not that I think it would change things as it seems most people forget
what little bit of history they get taught in school not long after
leaving school.
Post by Adam H. Kerman
I despite prettying up history. Trump was still wrong.
Agreed. History is full of ugly moments that are best
remembered in
the hopes that we don't repeat them.
A descriptive plaque with any such statue would seem to be so
obvious a solution that you have to wonder if both sides
vehemently oppose it.
We don't need statues to learn history.
In fact, these statues seem to be about forgetting it...
Also: my point is that, even if Trump had said verbatim "Nazis are
fine people", it'd be defensible as a (non-Freudian) slip of the
tongue ...because Trump simply isn't suicidal.  And, trying to
indict him on such weak claims only undercuts the many strong ones.
None of what you said has anything to do with the facts in evidence.
The fact is that even if there were a video of Trump saying "Nazis
are fine people" (which, afaik, there isn't) it would beggar
plausibility.
He said there are fine people on both sides.  Why don't you get what
the discussion is about?
Yes, but the two sides weren't "Nazis" and "non-Nazis".  (Yes, I know
that all the Nazis were on only one of the sides.)
The topic was neo-Nazis. This is exhausting.


Reporter: "Mr. President, are you putting what you’re calling the
alt-left and white supremacists on the same moral plane?"

Trump: "I’m not putting anybody on a moral plane. What I’m saying is
this: You had a group on one side and you had a group on the other, and
they came at each other with clubs -- and it was vicious and it was
horrible. And it was a horrible thing to watch.

"But there is another side. There was a group on this side. You can call
them the left -- you just called them the left -- that came violently
attacking the other group. So you can say what you want, but that’s the
way it is.

Reporter: (Inaudible) "… both sides, sir. You said there was hatred,
there was violence on both sides. Are the --"

Trump: "Yes, I think there’s blame on both sides. If you look at both
sides -- I think there’s blame on both sides. And I have no doubt about
it, and you don’t have any doubt about it either. And if you reported it
accurately, you would say."

Reporter: "The neo-Nazis started this. They showed up in Charlottesville
to protest --"

Trump: "Excuse me, excuse me. They didn’t put themselves -- and you had
some very bad people in that group, but you also had people that were
very fine people, on both sides. You had people in that group. Excuse
me, excuse me. I saw the same pictures as you did. You had people in
that group that were there to protest the taking down of, to them, a
very, very important statue and the renaming of a park from Robert E.
Lee to another name."
moviePig
2024-07-01 15:58:39 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by moviePig
Post by trotsky
Post by moviePig
Post by moviePig
Post by trotsky
Post by moviePig
Post by shawn
On Fri, 28 Jun 2024 19:39:52 -0000 (UTC), "Adam H. Kerman"
Post by Adam H. Kerman
Post by BTR1701
It's seven years after the fact and the damage has long
since been done, but
the left-wing fact checkers at Snopes have finally come out
and admitted the
whole claim that Trump called neo-Nazis "very fine people"
was a hoax. I have
no idea why, but credit where it's due, I suppose?
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-people/
Eh
It's another example of the more Trump talked, the more he buried
himself. There was no way for him to win. He should have ignored it, or
limited his comments to condemning the murder.
I don't put the "let's go beat up Nazis" counterprotestors on a high
moral plane. As far as I could tell, the protestors on both sides had
pretty low morals.
I've personally objected to the removal of Civil War
monuments making
the generals god-like, but MY reason is rather different than the
neo-Nazis: I don't think the modern generation should be re-writing
history. A past generation erected those monuments and we need to look
the ugliness of American history square in the face so we never forget
that Civil War generals were honored by certain Americans for
the modern
politics of that era.
People are worried about those statues glorifying the actions of those
people. I don't think the reasons behind the erecting of the statues
or the timing is brought up that often. Certainly I never knew growing
up the time frame for the erecting of the statues or the actual
reasons behind it. It would be better to have kept the statues and put
more effort into teaching the history behind their erection.
Not that I think it would change things as it seems most people forget
what little bit of history they get taught in school not long after
leaving school.
Post by Adam H. Kerman
I despite prettying up history. Trump was still wrong.
Agreed. History is full of ugly moments that are best
remembered in
the hopes that we don't repeat them.
A descriptive plaque with any such statue would seem to be so
obvious a solution that you have to wonder if both sides
vehemently oppose it.
We don't need statues to learn history.
In fact, these statues seem to be about forgetting it...
Also: my point is that, even if Trump had said verbatim "Nazis are
fine people", it'd be defensible as a (non-Freudian) slip of the
tongue ...because Trump simply isn't suicidal.  And, trying to
indict him on such weak claims only undercuts the many strong ones.
None of what you said has anything to do with the facts in evidence.
The fact is that even if there were a video of Trump saying "Nazis
are fine people" (which, afaik, there isn't) it would beggar
plausibility.
He said there are fine people on both sides.  Why don't you get what
the discussion is about?
Yes, but the two sides weren't "Nazis" and "non-Nazis".  (Yes, I know
that all the Nazis were on only one of the sides.)
The topic was neo-Nazis.  This is exhausting.
Reporter: "Mr. President, are you putting what you’re calling the
alt-left and white supremacists on the same moral plane?"
Trump: "I’m not putting anybody on a moral plane. What I’m saying is
this: You had a group on one side and you had a group on the other, and
they came at each other with clubs -- and it was vicious and it was
horrible. And it was a horrible thing to watch.
"But there is another side. There was a group on this side. You can call
them the left -- you just called them the left -- that came violently
attacking the other group. So you can say what you want, but that’s the
way it is.
Reporter: (Inaudible) "… both sides, sir. You said there was hatred,
there was violence on both sides. Are the --"
Trump: "Yes, I think there’s blame on both sides. If you look at both
sides -- I think there’s blame on both sides. And I have no doubt about
it, and you don’t have any doubt about it either. And if you reported it
accurately, you would say."
Reporter: "The neo-Nazis started this. They showed up in Charlottesville
to protest --"
Trump: "Excuse me, excuse me. They didn’t put themselves -- and you had
some very bad people in that group, but you also had people that were
very fine people, on both sides. You had people in that group. Excuse
me, excuse me. I saw the same pictures as you did. You had people in
that group that were there to protest the taking down of, to them, a
very, very important statue and the renaming of a park from Robert E.
Lee to another name."
Yes, a strict reading of that transcript has Trump speaking well of
"some neo-Nazis". But I don't see that the discourse is consistent
enough to support such rigor. (Few exchanges are, especially Trump's.)
E.g., note that at first the "sides" are alt-Left vs. white
supremacists, and later become statue-protesters vs. statue-defenders.
(And again, even if Trump had said "Nazis are fine people", I'd bet he
simply misspoke -- because he's not suicidal.)
trotsky
2024-06-30 09:38:25 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by moviePig
Post by trotsky
Post by moviePig
Post by shawn
On Fri, 28 Jun 2024 19:39:52 -0000 (UTC), "Adam H. Kerman"
Post by Adam H. Kerman
It's seven years after the fact and the damage has long since been done, but
the left-wing fact checkers at Snopes have finally come out and admitted the
whole claim that Trump called neo-Nazis "very fine people" was a hoax. I have
no idea why, but credit where it's due, I suppose?
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-people/
Eh
It's another example of the more Trump talked, the more he buried
himself. There was no way for him to win. He should have ignored it, or
limited his comments to condemning the murder.
I don't put the "let's go beat up Nazis" counterprotestors on a high
moral plane. As far as I could tell, the protestors on both sides had
pretty low morals.
I've personally objected to the removal of Civil War monuments making
the generals god-like, but MY reason is rather different than the
neo-Nazis: I don't think the modern generation should be re-writing
history. A past generation erected those monuments and we need to look
the ugliness of American history square in the face so we never forget
that Civil War generals were honored by certain Americans for the modern
politics of that era.
People are worried about those statues glorifying the actions of those
people. I don't think the reasons behind the erecting of the statues
or the timing is brought up that often. Certainly I never knew growing
up the time frame for the erecting of the statues or the actual
reasons behind it. It would be better to have kept the statues and put
more effort into teaching the history behind their erection.
Not that I think it would change things as it seems most people forget
what little bit of history they get taught in school not long after
leaving school.
Post by Adam H. Kerman
I despite prettying up history. Trump was still wrong.
Agreed. History is full of ugly moments that are best remembered in
the hopes that we don't repeat them.
A descriptive plaque with any such statue would seem to be so obvious
a solution that you have to wonder if both sides vehemently oppose it.
We don't need statues to learn history.
In fact, these statues seem to be about forgetting it...
That's a fair point.
The Horny Goat
2024-07-06 04:35:31 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by moviePig
Post by trotsky
We don't need statues to learn history.
In fact, these statues seem to be about forgetting it...
A lot of these statues actively the Old Confederacy (tm)
The Horny Goat
2024-07-06 20:17:21 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by The Horny Goat
Post by moviePig
Post by trotsky
We don't need statues to learn history.
In fact, these statues seem to be about forgetting it...
A lot of these statues actively the Old Confederacy (tm)
Hmmm. I've been on drugs following surgery this week and left out the
key word: "support". Obviously you can tell where the missing word was
intended to have gone...
shawn
2024-07-06 22:01:26 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by The Horny Goat
We don't need support statues to learn history.
In fact, these support statues seem to be about forgetting it...
A lot of these support statues actively the Old Confederacy support (tm)
Hmmm. I've been on drugs following surgery this week and left out the
key word: "support". Obviously you can tell where the missing word was
intended to have gone...
I've added back in the word "support" where you obviously meant it to
go. You are welcome.
moviePig
2024-07-06 22:07:25 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by shawn
Post by The Horny Goat
We don't need support statues to learn history.
In fact, these support statues seem to be about forgetting it...
A lot of these support statues actively the Old Confederacy support (tm)
Hmmm. I've been on drugs following surgery this week and left out the
key word: "support". Obviously you can tell where the missing word was
intended to have gone...
I've added back in the word "support" where you obviously meant it to
go. You are welcome.
A 'support statue' must be a lot like a 'comfort animal'...
The Horny Goat
2024-07-07 04:13:32 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Sat, 06 Jul 2024 18:01:26 -0400, shawn
Post by shawn
Post by The Horny Goat
A lot of these support statues actively the Old Confederacy support (tm)
Hmmm. I've been on drugs following surgery this week and left out the
key word: "support". Obviously you can tell where the missing word was
intended to have gone...
I've added back in the word "support" where you obviously meant it to
go. You are welcome.
Actually what I meant to say was that 'a lot of these statues actively
support the 'Old Confederacy'.

(My eyes hadn't healed enough to get me certified for driving by the
time I wrote that but hopefully will be when I next see the doc in 2
weeks...)
The Horny Goat
2024-07-06 04:34:30 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by moviePig
A descriptive plaque with any such statue would seem to be so obvious a
solution that you have to wonder if both sides vehemently oppose it.
While I agree with you I anticipate difficulties getting unanimity on
what said plaque should say - and how it might change over time.

A major polytechnic in Toronto got renamed after it was revealed that
the namesake was a big proponent of the Indian Residential School
system which the woke left now consider an important instrument in the
attempted genocide of aborignal peoples.

And Gawd help the well meaning historical buff who rejects the UN
Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples. (Currently adopted
hook line and sinker by Canadian politicians from Justin Trudeau to
local municipal mayors and councils) Rejecting UNDRIP is considered
proof of Neanderthalism (by Canadian politicians and "advocates") in
the same way that rejecting BLM Kendi and their ilk in today's
America.
NoBody
2024-06-29 14:23:44 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Fri, 28 Jun 2024 19:39:52 -0000 (UTC), "Adam H. Kerman"
Post by Adam H. Kerman
It's seven years after the fact and the damage has long since been done, but
the left-wing fact checkers at Snopes have finally come out and admitted the
whole claim that Trump called neo-Nazis "very fine people" was a hoax. I have
no idea why, but credit where it's due, I suppose?
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-people/
Eh
It's another example of the more Trump talked, the more he buried
himself. There was no way for him to win. He should have ignored it, or
limited his comments to condemning the murder.
I don't put the "let's go beat up Nazis" counterprotestors on a high
moral plane. As far as I could tell, the protestors on both sides had
pretty low morals.
I've personally objected to the removal of Civil War monuments making
the generals god-like, but MY reason is rather different than the
neo-Nazis: I don't think the modern generation should be re-writing
history. A past generation erected those monuments and we need to look
the ugliness of American history square in the face so we never forget
that Civil War generals were honored by certain Americans for the modern
politics of that era.
I despite prettying up history. Trump was still wrong.
And yet the media line on this subject is FINALLY debunked and you
blame Trump.
moviePig
2024-06-28 19:50:06 UTC
Reply
Permalink
It's seven years after the fact and the damage has long since been done, but
the left-wing fact checkers at Snopes have finally come out and admitted the
whole claim that Trump called neo-Nazis "very fine people" was a hoax. I have
no idea why, but credit where it's due, I suppose?
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-people/
Not even Trump would deliberately call Nazis "very fine people". Anyone
should realize that even somebody who thought it would never say it.
trotsky
2024-06-29 16:15:36 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by moviePig
It's seven years after the fact and the damage has long since been done, but
the left-wing fact checkers at Snopes have finally come out and admitted the
whole claim that Trump called neo-Nazis "very fine people" was a hoax. I have
no idea why, but credit where it's due, I suppose?
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-people/
Not even Trump would deliberately call Nazis "very fine people". Anyone
should realize that even somebody who thought it would never say it.
Maybe you should read the transcript I posted first.
moviePig
2024-06-29 17:04:18 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by trotsky
Post by moviePig
It's seven years after the fact and the damage has long since been done, but
the left-wing fact checkers at Snopes have finally come out and admitted the
whole claim that Trump called neo-Nazis "very fine people" was a hoax. I have
no idea why, but credit where it's due, I suppose?
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-people/
Not even Trump would deliberately call Nazis "very fine people".
Anyone should realize that even somebody who thought it would never
say it.
Maybe you should read the transcript I posted first.
Where?
trotsky
2024-06-30 09:41:40 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by moviePig
Post by trotsky
Post by moviePig
It's seven years after the fact and the damage has long since been done, but
the left-wing fact checkers at Snopes have finally come out and admitted the
whole claim that Trump called neo-Nazis "very fine people" was a hoax. I have
no idea why, but credit where it's due, I suppose?
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-people/
Not even Trump would deliberately call Nazis "very fine people".
Anyone should realize that even somebody who thought it would never
say it.
Maybe you should read the transcript I posted first.
Where?
Snopes usually isn't totally unreliable like they are here. Payola
maybe? Who the fuck cares. Politifact has an actual transcript of what
was said by Trump:

https://www.politifact.com/article/2019/apr/26/context-trumps-very-fine-people-both-sides-remarks/

On Aug. 15, 2017, President Donald Trump held a press conference to
discuss an executive order he had signed on infrastructure permitting.
Reporters shortly began asking questions about Trump’s initial response
to violent protests in Charlottesville, Va. It was at this press
conference that Trump said that "you also had people that were very fine
people, on both sides."

On April 25, 2019, former Vice President Joe Biden declared his 2020
candidacy for the Democratic nomination and the presidency by recalling
the events in Charlottesville and Trump’s comments. "With those words,
the president of the United States assigned a moral equivalence between
those spreading hate and those with the courage to stand against it,"
Biden said.

The next day, Trump responded, saying "If you look at what I said, you
will see that that question was answered perfectly. And I was talking
about people that went because they felt very strongly about the
monument to Robert E. Lee, a great general. Whether you like it or not,
he was one of the great generals." Trump also said he would defeat Biden
"very easily."

We wanted to look at Trump’s comments in their original context. Here is
a transcript of the questions Trump answered that addressed the
Charlottesville controversy in the days after it happened. (His specific
remarks about "very fine people, on both sides" come in the final third
of the transcript.)

• • •

Reporter: "Let me ask you, Mr. President, why did you wait so long to
blast neo-Nazis?"

Trump: "I didn’t wait long. I didn’t wait long."

Reporter: "Forty-eight hours."

Trump: "I wanted to make sure, unlike most politicians, that what I said
was correct -- not make a quick statement. The statement I made on
Saturday, the first statement, was a fine statement. But you don’t make
statements that direct unless you know the facts. It takes a little
while to get the facts. You still don’t know the facts. And it’s a very,
very important process to me, and it’s a very important statement.

"So I don’t want to go quickly and just make a statement for the sake of
making a political statement. I want to know the facts. If you go back to --

Reporter: "So you had to (inaudible) white supremacists?"

Trump: "I brought it. I brought it. I brought it."

Reporter: "Was it terrorism, in your opinion, what happened?"

Trump: "As I said on -- remember, Saturday -- we condemn in the
strongest possible terms this egregious display of hatred, bigotry, and
violence. It has no place in America. And then it went on from there.
Now, here’s the thing --"

Reporter: (Inaudible)

Trump: "Excuse me. Excuse me. Take it nice and easy. Here’s the thing:
When I make a statement, I like to be correct. I want the facts. This
event just happened. In fact, a lot of the event didn’t even happen yet,
as we were speaking. This event just happened.

"Before I make a statement, I need the facts. So I don’t want to rush
into a statement. So making the statement when I made it was excellent.
In fact, the young woman, who I hear was a fantastic young woman, and it
was on NBC -- her mother wrote me and said through, I guess, Twitter,
social media, the nicest things. And I very much appreciated that. I
hear she was a fine -- really, actually, an incredible young woman. But
her mother, on Twitter, thanked me for what I said.

"And honestly, if the press were not fake, and if it was honest, the
press would have said what I said was very nice. But unlike you, and
unlike -- excuse me, unlike you and unlike the media, before I make a
statement, I like to know the facts."

(crosstalk)

Reporter: "The CEO of Walmart said you missed a critical opportunity to
help bring the country together. Did you?"

Trump: "Not at all. I think the country -- look, you take a look. I’ve
created over a million jobs since I’m President. The country is booming.
The stock market is setting records. We have the highest employment
numbers we’ve ever had in the history of our country. We’re doing record
business. We have the highest levels of enthusiasm. So the head of
Walmart, who I know -- who’s a very nice guy -- was making a political
statement. I mean -- I’d do it the same way. And you know why? Because I
want to make sure, when I make a statement, that the statement is
correct. And there was no way -- there was no way of making a correct
statement that early. I had to see the facts, unlike a lot of reporters.
Unlike a lot of reporters --

Reporter: "Nazis were there."

Reporter: "David Duke was there."

Trump: "I didn’t know David Duke was there. I wanted to see the facts.
And the facts, as they started coming out, were very well stated. In
fact, everybody said, ‘His statement was beautiful. If he would have
made it sooner, that would have been good.’ I couldn’t have made it
sooner because I didn’t know all of the facts. Frankly, people still
don’t know all of the facts.

"It was very important -- excuse me, excuse me -- it was very important
to me to get the facts out and correctly. Because if I would have made a
fast statement -- and the first statement was made without knowing much,
other than what we were seeing. The second statement was made after,
with knowledge, with great knowledge. There are still things -- excuse
me -- there are still things that people don’t know. I want to make a
statement with knowledge. I wanted to know the facts."

Reporter: "Two questions. Was this terrorism? And can you tell us how
you’re feeling about your chief strategist, Stephen Bannon?"

Trump: "Well, I think the driver of the car is a disgrace to himself,
his family, and this country. And that is -- you can call it terrorism.
You can call it murder. You can call it whatever you want. I would just
call it as the fastest one to come up with a good verdict. That’s what
I’d call it. Because there is a question: Is it murder? Is it
terrorism? And then you get into legal semantics. The driver of the car
is a murderer. And what he did was a horrible, horrible, inexcusable thing.

(crosstalk)

Reporter: "Can you tell us broadly what your -- do you still have
confidence in Steve?"

Trump: "Well, we’ll see. Look, look -- I like Mr. Bannon. He’s a friend
of mine. But Mr. Bannon came on very late. You know that. I went through
17 senators, governors, and I won all the primaries. Mr. Bannon came on
very much later than that. And I like him, he’s a good man. He is not a
racist, I can tell you that. He’s a good person. He actually gets very
unfair press in that regard. But we’ll see what happens with Mr. Bannon.
But he’s a good person, and I think the press treats him, frankly, very
unfairly."

(crosstalk)

Reporter: "Sen. (John) McCain said that the alt-right is behind these
attacks, and he linked that same group to those who perpetrated the
attack in Charlottesville."

Trump: "Well, I don’t know. I can’t tell you. I’m sure Senator McCain
must know what he’s talking about. But when you say the alt-right,
define alt-right to me. You define it. Go ahead."

Reporter: "Well, I’m saying, as Senator --"

Trump: "No, define it for me. Come on, let’s go. Define it for me."

Reporter: "Senator McCain defined them as the same group --"

Trump: "Okay, what about the alt-left that came charging at -- excuse
me, what about the alt-left that came charging at the, as you say, the
alt-right? Do they have any semblance of guilt?

"Let me ask you this: What about the fact that they came charging with
clubs in their hands, swinging clubs? Do they have any problem? I think
they do. As far as I’m concerned, that was a horrible, horrible day.
Wait a minute. I’m not finished. I’m not finished, fake news. That was a
horrible day --

" I will tell you something. I watched those very closely -- much more
closely than you people watched it. And you have -- you had a group on
one side that was bad, and you had a group on the other side that was
also very violent. And nobody wants to say that, but I’ll say it right
now. You had a group -- you had a group on the other side that came
charging in, without a permit, and they were very, very violent."

Reporter: "Do you think that what you call the alt-left is the same as
neo-Nazis?"

Trump: "Those people -- all of those people – excuse me, I’ve condemned
neo-Nazis. I’ve condemned many different groups. But not all of those
people were neo-Nazis, believe me. Not all of those people were white
supremacists by any stretch. Those people were also there because they
wanted to protest the taking down of a statue of Robert E. Lee."

Reporter: "Should that statue be taken down?"

Trump: "Excuse me. If you take a look at some of the groups, and you see
-- and you’d know it if you were honest reporters, which in many cases
you’re not -- but many of those people were there to protest the taking
down of the statue of Robert E. Lee.

"So this week it’s Robert E. Lee. I noticed that Stonewall Jackson is
coming down. I wonder, is it George Washington next week? And is it
Thomas Jefferson the week after? You know, you really do have to ask
yourself, where does it stop?

"But they were there to protest -- excuse me, if you take a look, the
night before they were there to protest the taking down of the statue of
Robert E. Lee. Infrastructure question. Go ahead."

Reporter: "Should the statues of Robert E. Lee stay up?"

Trump: "I would say that’s up to a local town, community, or the federal
government, depending on where it is located."

Reporter: "How concerned are you about race relations in America? And do
you think things have gotten worse or better since you took office?"

Trump: "I think they’ve gotten better or the same. Look, they’ve been
frayed for a long time. And you can ask President Obama about that,
because he’d make speeches about it. But I believe that the fact that I
brought in -- it will be soon -- millions of jobs -- you see where
companies are moving back into our country -- I think that’s going to
have a tremendous, positive impact on race relations.

"We have companies coming back into our country. We have two car
companies that just announced. We have Foxconn in Wisconsin just
announced. We have many companies, I say, pouring back into the country.
I think that’s going to have a huge, positive impact on race relations.
You know why? It’s jobs. What people want now, they want jobs. They want
great jobs with good pay, and when they have that, you watch how race
relations will be.

"And I’ll tell you, we’re spending a lot of money on the inner cities.
We’re fixing the inner cities. We’re doing far more than anybody has
done with respect to the inner cities. It’s a priority for me, and it’s
very important."

Reporter: "Mr. President, are you putting what you’re calling the
alt-left and white supremacists on the same moral plane?"

Trump: "I’m not putting anybody on a moral plane. What I’m saying is
this: You had a group on one side and you had a group on the other, and
they came at each other with clubs -- and it was vicious and it was
horrible. And it was a horrible thing to watch.

"But there is another side. There was a group on this side. You can call
them the left -- you just called them the left -- that came violently
attacking the other group. So you can say what you want, but that’s the
way it is.

Reporter: (Inaudible) "… both sides, sir. You said there was hatred,
there was violence on both sides. Are the --"

Trump: "Yes, I think there’s blame on both sides. If you look at both
sides -- I think there’s blame on both sides. And I have no doubt about
it, and you don’t have any doubt about it either. And if you reported it
accurately, you would say."

Reporter: "The neo-Nazis started this. They showed up in Charlottesville
to protest --"

Trump: "Excuse me, excuse me. They didn’t put themselves -- and you had
some very bad people in that group, but you also had people that were
very fine people, on both sides. You had people in that group. Excuse
me, excuse me. I saw the same pictures as you did. You had people in
that group that were there to protest the taking down of, to them, a
very, very important statue and the renaming of a park from Robert E.
Lee to another name."

Reporter: "George Washington and Robert E. Lee are not the same."

Trump: "George Washington was a slave owner. Was George Washington a
slave owner? So will George Washington now lose his status? Are we going
to take down -- excuse me, are we going to take down statues to George
Washington? How about Thomas Jefferson? What do you think of Thomas
Jefferson? You like him?"

Reporter: "I do love Thomas Jefferson."

Trump: "Okay, good. Are we going to take down the statue? Because he was
a major slave owner. Now, are we going to take down his statue?

"So you know what, it’s fine. You’re changing history. You’re changing
culture. And you had people -- and I’m not talking about the neo-Nazis
and the white nationalists -- because they should be condemned totally.
But you had many people in that group other than neo-Nazis and white
nationalists. Okay? And the press has treated them absolutely unfairly.

"Now, in the other group also, you had some fine people. But you also
had troublemakers, and you see them come with the black outfits and with
the helmets, and with the baseball bats. You had a lot of bad people in
the other group."

Reporter: "Sir, I just didn’t understand what you were saying. You were
saying the press has treated white nationalists unfairly? I just don’t
understand what you were saying."

Trump: "No, no. There were people in that rally -- and I looked the
night before -- if you look, there were people protesting very quietly
the taking down of the statue of Robert E. Lee. I’m sure in that group
there were some bad ones. The following day it looked like they had some
rough, bad people -- neo-Nazis, white nationalists, whatever you want to
call them.

"But you had a lot of people in that group that were there to innocently
protest, and very legally protest -- because, I don’t know if you know,
they had a permit. The other group didn’t have a permit. So I only tell
you this: There are two sides to a story. I thought what took place was
a horrible moment for our country -- a horrible moment. But there are
two sides to the country.

"Does anybody have a final --

Reporter: "What makes you think you can get an infrastructure bill? You
didn’t get health care --

Trump: "Well, you know, I’ll tell you. We came very close with health
care. Unfortunately, John McCain decided to vote against it at the last
minute. You’ll have to ask John McCain why he did that. But we came very
close to health care. We will end up getting health care. But we’ll get
the infrastructure. And actually, infrastructure is something that I
think we’ll have bipartisan support on. I actually think Democrats will
go along with the infrastructure."

Reporter: "Mr. President, have you spoken to the family of the victim of
the car attack?"

Trump: "No, I’ll be reaching out. I’ll be reaching out."

Reporter: "When will you be reaching out?"

Trump: "I thought that the statement put out -- the mother’s statement I
thought was a beautiful statement. I will tell you, it was something
that I really appreciated. I thought it was terrific. And, really, under
the kind of stress that she’s under and the heartache that she’s under,
I thought putting out that statement, to me, was really something. I
won’t forget it.

"You look at what I said, you will see that that question was answered
perfectly. And I was talking about people that went because they felt
very strongly about the monument to Robert E. Lee, a great general."


Oath Keeper Twat gets a rating of "spewing horseshit yet again."
moviePig
2024-06-30 16:45:02 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by moviePig
Post by trotsky
Post by moviePig
It's seven years after the fact and the damage has long since been done, but
the left-wing fact checkers at Snopes have finally come out and admitted the
whole claim that Trump called neo-Nazis "very fine people" was a hoax. I have
no idea why, but credit where it's due, I suppose?
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-people/
Not even Trump would deliberately call Nazis "very fine people".
Anyone should realize that even somebody who thought it would never
say it.
Maybe you should read the transcript I posted first.
Where?
Snopes usually isn't totally unreliable like they are here.  Payola
maybe?  Who the fuck cares.  Politifact has an actual transcript of what
https://www.politifact.com/article/2019/apr/26/context-trumps-very-fine-people-both-sides-remarks/
... [lengthy transcipt] ...
Yes, Trump is a mealy-mouthed SOB who doesn't want to risk alienating
even the vermin among his supporters.

Meanwhile, enjoy every word of this (via Reddit):

----------------
“Talented and well-practiced in every vice. A stranger to compassion or
empathy. A liar and a cheat so complete in perfidy that he has elevated
his dishonesty to hold it up as an ersatz moral principle.

Violent. So long as he can order someone else to do the dirty work.
Grotesque in body, honorless in action, in possession of a wounded
self-regard so colossal as to smother any spark of grace.

Treasonous. Not only to his country but to every ally he has ever had.
The poisoned fruit and rankest flower of racism and contempt for women,
and utterly devoid of shame for his moral and spiritual bankruptcy.

That is your leader. That is to whom you give your money. That is whom
you follow and laud. That is whose banner you willingly carry.

Why?

Because he is a mirror, not a lighthouse. You see yourselves in him. He
is what you would be if you had inherited money and could shed the last
vestiges of conscience and shame.

No, I do not “respect your choices,” nor do I admire your loyalty and
dedication to this miserific, demoniac vision. You have demonstrated not
only a lack of civic virtue, and loyalty to the Republic, and to the
rule of law, but a willingness to engage in violence and sedition at his
slightest expressed wish. And you will never, ever admit you were wrong.

Because you see your dark, twisted, resentful dreams in him, and to
renounce him, is to renounce yourselves.”

----------------
NoBody
2024-06-30 14:43:04 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by trotsky
Post by moviePig
It's seven years after the fact and the damage has long since been done, but
the left-wing fact checkers at Snopes have finally come out and admitted the
whole claim that Trump called neo-Nazis "very fine people" was a hoax. I have
no idea why, but credit where it's due, I suppose?
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-people/
Not even Trump would deliberately call Nazis "very fine people". Anyone
should realize that even somebody who thought it would never say it.
Maybe you should read the transcript I posted first.
Maybe you should read the Snopes debunking the story first.
trotsky
2024-06-30 20:22:31 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by NoBody
Post by trotsky
Post by moviePig
It's seven years after the fact and the damage has long since been done, but
the left-wing fact checkers at Snopes have finally come out and admitted the
whole claim that Trump called neo-Nazis "very fine people" was a hoax. I have
no idea why, but credit where it's due, I suppose?
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-people/
Not even Trump would deliberately call Nazis "very fine people". Anyone
should realize that even somebody who thought it would never say it.
Maybe you should read the transcript I posted first.
Maybe you should read the Snopes debunking the story first.
Well anonyshitted and fucked in the head.
FPP
2024-07-08 23:06:50 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by trotsky
Post by moviePig
It's seven years after the fact and the damage has long since been done, but
the left-wing fact checkers at Snopes have finally come out and admitted the
whole claim that Trump called neo-Nazis "very fine people" was a hoax. I have
no idea why, but credit where it's due, I suppose?
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-people/
Not even Trump would deliberately call Nazis "very fine people".
Anyone should realize that even somebody who thought it would never
say it.
Maybe you should read the transcript I posted first.
I've pretty much had it up to here with these clowns.
You can only take so much bullshit, ya' know?
--
On May 30, 2024 Donald J. Trump was unanimously convicted on 34 felony
counts in New York City... so I took this picture in my side yard.

Loading Image...

"Thou shalt not make a machine in the likeness of a man’s mind." - OC
Bible 25B.G.
Loading Image...
Ubiquitous
2024-07-09 15:05:46 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by FPP
Post by trotsky
Post by moviePig
Post by BTR1701
It's seven years after the fact and the damage has long since been
done, but the left-wing fact checkers at Snopes have finally come
out and admitted the whole claim that Trump called neo-Nazis "very
fine people" was a hoax. I have no idea why, but credit where it's
due, I suppose?
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-people/
Not even Trump would deliberately call Nazis "very fine people".
Anyone should realize that even somebody who thought it would never
say it.
Maybe you should read the transcript I posted first.
I've pretty much had it up to here with these clowns.
One would think you would be used to losing debates here by now.
Try not to be a sore looser, mkay?

--
Let's go Brandon!

Ubiquitous
2024-06-29 01:40:27 UTC
Reply
Permalink
It's seven years after the fact and the damage has long since been done, but
the left-wing fact checkers at Snopes have finally come out and admitted the
whole claim that Trump called neo-Nazis "very fine people" was a hoax. I
have no idea why, but credit where it's due, I suppose?
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-very-fine-people/
I guess someone forgot to tell DoJ-certified imbecile Joke Biden while
prepping for the debaucle of a debate last night.

--
Let's go Brandon!
super70s
2024-07-06 20:36:58 UTC
Reply
Permalink
It's seven years after the fact and the damage has long since been done, but
the left-wing fact checkers at Snopes
are so hard up for hits they thought they'd come out with this
ridiculous clickbait.
Ubiquitous
2024-07-08 08:30:48 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by super70s
Post by BTR1701
It's seven years after the fact and the damage has long since been done,
but the left-wing fact checkers at Snopes
are so hard up for hits they thought they'd come out with this
ridiculous clickbait.
The lengths to which some leftists will go to deny the truth...

--
Let's go Brandon!
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